The Christ and the Power

[iambiguous]

@Bob

@felix dakat

Right right right “the points you made”. That’s your other pastime, where are you ostensibly seek solutions to a problem and then proceed to dismiss all possible solutions. I’ve been there and done that with you once. That was enough for me.

Exactly, there is a limit to being patient with people who seem to be wasting everyone’s time. I have no doubts that there are people here with conditions and disturbances, with trauma and sadness, but it is unreasonable to think that they can be helped with arguments for or against anything. I have learnt a lot in exchanges with people here, but I have listened and accepted another’s point of view, or I have challenged it. But there is a limit, and the failure to accept this is their problem.

Of course: to the extent that he actually believes this is the extent to which my respect for his intelligence diminishes.

But, just out of curiosity, would someone here please take the time to note the most effective challenges he made to the points I raised in my own discussions with him?

Instead, as with felix, it was basically “wiggle, wiggle, wiggle” all the way.

But, sure, I’m willing to give him one more chance. And, if not now, maybe later:

The “points I raised” regarding Christ and the Power in Mayfield:

And how is nature not but doing its thing at the behest of the God that created nature itself? Back again to Kushner’s God or God’s mysterious ways.

Either God created planet Earth with all of its built-in “natural disasters” or He didn’t.

Instead, the grim reality for hundreds in Kentucky right now is that they either fall back on their faith in order to at least have something to explain their terrible losses, or they accept that sans God their lives are essentially meaningless and this tragedy is but one more manifestation of the “brute facticity” that is the “human condition” in a No God world.

And…

Christ/God is solely responsible for the very existence of tornadoes. A tornado did its thing in the city of Mayfield. Now those who were devastated by it are asked to choose acts of kindness in responding to others who were devastated by it.

Though again, sure, what else is there?

It’s like this scene from The Thorn Birds: youtu.be/3-uRUTTz0Q0

[felix_dakat]

Ain’t it awful?

[iambiguous]

@felix dakat

@Bob

@felix dakat

Right right right “the points you made”. That’s your other pastime, where are you ostensibly seek solutions to a problem and then proceed to dismiss all possible solutions. I’ve been there and done that with you once. That was enough for me.

Exactly, there is a limit to being patient with people who seem to be wasting everyone’s time. I have no doubts that there are people here with conditions and disturbances, with trauma and sadness, but it is unreasonable to think that they can be helped with arguments for or against anything. I have learnt a lot in exchanges with people here, but I have listened and accepted another’s point of view, or I have challenged it. But there is a limit, and the failure to accept this is their problem.

Posting here is a pastime for all of us. Those of us who are capable of insight ought to be aware of the games we’re playing and take responsibility for the results. That from a purely pragmatic consequentialist standpoint if nothing else. From my point of view there are still many people here who are doing that. I Hope You know who You are. Thank you!

Yeah, I can play games here. I can shift into my polemicist persona, for example.

But I can also “raise points” in a philosophy venue that are meant to avoid all that.

And anytime Bob and Felix are willing to end their “make it all about iambiguous” game and address the points I raised above in an intelligent and civil discussion, we can take it from there.

[iambiguous]

@felix dakat

Ain’t it awful?

Sure, you can walk the streets of Mayfield today and point that out to folks.

But that still doesn’t make my points above go away.

[felix_dakat]

@iambiguous

@felix dakat

Ain’t it awful?

Sure, you can walk the streets of Mayfield today and point that out to folks.

But that still doesn’t make my points above go away.

Right. It’s summarizes your points above.

[felix_dakat]

@felix dakat

@iambiguous

@felix dakat

Ain’t it awful?

Sure, you can walk the streets of Mayfield today and point that out to folks.

But that still doesn’t make my points above go away.

Right. It’s summarizes your points above.

In an alternative fantasy you can walk up and down the streets of Mayfield exclaiming “ain’t it awful” lest they find ways of “comforting and consoling” each other.

[felix_dakat]

By the way the temperature there last night reached the freezing point so anything anyone can do to provide power or heat for the people there will be appreciated. Surprisingly power was restored to some people in the area on Sunday.

[iambiguous]

@felix dakat

@iambiguous

@felix dakat

Ain’t it awful?

Sure, you can walk the streets of Mayfield today and point that out to folks.

But that still doesn’t make my points above go away.

Right. It’s summarizes your points above.

“It’s summarizes”?

Look, you and Bob are basically arguing that even if the points I made above are intelligent and reasonable and relevant relating to the “act of God” that devastated Mayfield, they would only make the victims there feel worse.

Again, as though the whole point of philosophy – of being wise – is to comfort and console people instead.

You know, like religion.

[felix_dakat]

As a moral nihilist, what morality are you holding God to in your problem of evil argument?

[iambiguous]

@felix dakat

By the way the temperature there last night reached the freezing point so anything anyone can do to provide power or heat for the people there will be appreciated. Surprisingly power was restored to some people in the area on Sunday.

On the other hand, not being omnipotent yourself, you might pray to God, – said to be omnipotent by many – to do that Himself.

[felix_dakat]

As a self-declared moral nihilist, what morality are you holding God to in your problem of evil argument?

[felix_dakat]

@iambiguous

@felix dakat

By the way the temperature there last night reached the freezing point so anything anyone can do to provide power or heat for the people there will be appreciated. Surprisingly power was restored to some people in the area on Sunday.

On the other hand, not being omnipotent yourself, you might pray to God, – said to be omnipotent by many – to do that Himself.

That ain’t how it works. Ain’t it awful!

[iambiguous]

@felix dakat

As a moral nihilist, what morality are you holding God to in your problem of evil argument?

As a mere mortal, what could I possibly know with any degree of certainty about that? Instead, I’m interested in how those who insist that their own God is loving, just and merciful, rationalize events in Mayfield that, if mere mortals were responsible for them, they’d be called grossly, savagely unjust, unloving, and merciless.

Why, re the first chapter in Genesis, did God [the God of Moses] create planet Earth to be an excruciating hellhole for millions over and over and over again. God and the twister. God and the covid-19 virus. God and the “any day now” super volcano under Yellowstone.

Sure, many will, in all sincerity, fall back on God’s “mysterious ways” and accept it all subjectively in a leap of more or less blind faith. In church, for example.

But in a philosophy venue – or, rather, what’s left of this one – the discussions are able to go deeper.

If deeper is actually where some here want to go.

Again, with all that is at stake here on both sides of the grave.

[iambiguous]

@felix dakat

@iambiguous

@felix dakat

By the way the temperature there last night reached the freezing point so anything anyone can do to provide power or heat for the people there will be appreciated. Surprisingly power was restored to some people in the area on Sunday.

On the other hand, not being omnipotent yourself, you might pray to God, – said to be omnipotent by many – to do that Himself.

That ain’t how it works. Ain’t it awful!

Okay, then how does it work for you?

You and God and Mayfield.

Connect the dots here for us.

[felix_dakat]

@iambiguous

@felix dakat

As a moral nihilist, what morality are you holding God to in your problem of evil argument?

As a mere mortal, what could I possibly know with any degree of certainty about that? Instead, I’m interested in how those who insist that their own God is loving, just and merciful, rationalize events in Mayfield that, if mere mortals were responsible for them, they’d be called grossly, savagely unjust, unloving, and merciless.

Why, re the first chapter in Genesis, did God [the God of Moses] create planet Earth to be an excruciating hellhole for millions over and over and over again. God and the twister. God and the covid-19 virus. God and the “any day now” super volcano under Yellowstone.

Sure, many will, in all sincerity, fall back on God’s “mysterious ways” and accept it all subjectively in a leap of more or less blind faith. In church, for example.

But in a philosophy venue – or, rather, what’s left of this one – the discussions are able to go deeper.

If deeper is actually where some here want to go.

Again, with all that is at stake here on both sides of the grave.

I know! Ain’t it awful? Hell or no hell not withstanding, won’t you be happier dead? I think non-existence will suit you nicely, compared to how awful life is to your Dasein.

[Ecmandu]

I’m going to say this very simply to everyone on these boards:

We all live forever.

Our only option is memory wipes (but even those can be retrieved)

There are beings who can resurrect everyone.

I’m one of them actually.

The reason you should “live” (not have a memory wipe)

Is to bring abusers to justice with your testimony.

Otherwise, they’ll keep bringing you back and torment over and over forever.

You’re allowed to do that with your spirit in the current plan.

Understand this though… it affects other spirits.

We live in a karma and grace system.

When you exhaust those: you’re fucked.

[Meno2 (Meno_)]

@Ecmandu

I’m going to say this very simply to everyone on these boards:

We all live forever.

Our only option is memory wipes (but even those can be retrieved)

There are beings who can resurrect everyone.

I’m one of them actually.

The reason you should “live” (not have a memory wipe)

Is to bring abusers to justice with your testimony.

Otherwise, they’ll keep bringing you back and torment over and over forever.

You’re allowed to do that with your spirit in the current plan.

Understand this though… it affects other spirits.

We live in a karma and grace system.

When you exhaust those: you’re fucked.

For those cynical and some playing a devils advocate, can You prove it?

[Ecmandu]

@Meno_

@Ecmandu

I’m going to say this very simply to everyone on these boards:

We all live forever.

Our only option is memory wipes (but even those can be retrieved)

There are beings who can resurrect everyone.

I’m one of them actually.

The reason you should “live” (not have a memory wipe)

Is to bring abusers to justice with your testimony.

Otherwise, they’ll keep bringing you back and torment over and over forever.

You’re allowed to do that with your spirit in the current plan.

Understand this though… it affects other spirits.

We live in a karma and grace system.

When you exhaust those: you’re fucked.

For those cynical and some playing a devils advocate, can You prove it?

Actually I can. I can prove it with my spirit. But that’s not what you’re asking. You want me to prove it with rudimentary words.

So I will.

What happens if existence ever blinks out of existence?

You exist right? You wouldn’t be here.

Same with your spirit.

If your spirit blinked out of existence… you wouldn’t be here.

But let’s go further. Existence is not symmetrical. If existence were symmetrical every ‘particle’ would have an anti particle and all this would be nothing from beginning to end.

You are not symmetrical either.

If you were created. Something came from nothing. Impossible. You were never born, you were never created, and you will never die.

Hell does exist. The question is what lands you there and how much.

Consent violation lands you in hell. Everyone has no choice but to do consent violation. Some are better than this than others, so, they get a lesser hell if they violate consent like a soft whisper.

People like them. Karma is just how much people like you.

How do I explain this in human terms? Give me a moment.

Existence is imagination. Heaven and hell are pure imagination. Also contracts. You do not ever want to end up in a place where pure imagination wants to make you suffer.

I’ll stop there for now.

Ask me more or to clarify.

[Meno2 (Meno_)]

@Ecmandu

@Meno_

@Ecmandu

I’m going to say this very simply to everyone on these boards:

We all live forever.

Our only option is memory wipes (but even those can be retrieved)

There are beings who can resurrect everyone.

I’m one of them actually.

The reason you should “live” (not have a memory wipe)

Is to bring abusers to justice with your testimony.

Otherwise, they’ll keep bringing you back and torment over and over forever.

You’re allowed to do that with your spirit in the current plan.

Understand this though… it affects other spirits.

We live in a karma and grace system.

When you exhaust those: you’re fucked.

For those cynical and some playing a devils advocate, can You prove it?

Actually I can. I can prove it with my spirit. But that’s not what you’re asking. You want me to prove it with rudimentary words.

So I will.

What happens if existence ever blinks out of existence?

You exist right? You wouldn’t be here.

Same with your spirit.

If your spirit blinked out of existence… you wouldn’t be here.

But let’s go further. Existence is not symmetrical. If existence were symmetrical every ‘particle’ would have an anti particle and all this would be nothing from beginning to end.

You are not symmetrical either.

If you were created. Something came from nothing. Impossible. You were never born, you were never created, and you will never die.

Hell does exist. The question is what lands you there and how much.

Consent violation lands you in hell. Everyone has no choice but to do consent violation. Some are better than this than others, so, they get a lesser hell if they violate consent like a soft whisper.

People like them. Karma is just how much people like you.

How do I explain this in human terms? Give me a moment.

Existence is imagination. Heaven and hell are pure imagination. Also contracts. You do not ever want to end up in a place where pure imagination wants to make you suffer.

I’ll stop there for now.

Ask me more or to clarify.

Since I agree with You in form, I do not need to clarify at least not verbally because I think formal recognition connects perceptive realization with postscriptive logical understanding.

I do agree to formal arguments You propose and not as countered by such platitudes that religion and religious philosophy are mere cop outs to cuddle up with.

[Lorikeet (Satyr)]

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6JU9J0XVlzQ[/youtube]