The Good Life, The Best Life

Philosophy Forums Philosophy
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The question, what is the good life? underpins many of our assumptions about what is good or bad, or what is worthwhile or pointless. The answer to this question, at least on the level of appearance, has changed over the ages and differs among individuals and cultures.

The question, what is the good life? has variously been given answers such as ‘being virtuous’, or ‘being a morally upright person’. Answers on how to acheive those states (and even whether their acheivement is possible for anyone/everyone) has also varied among cultures and philosophers. The question is also frequently given answers in the modern age such as ‘being happy’ and ‘satisfying desires’, which again both entail necessities to effect their acheivement.

Another answer to the question, most famously given by Socrates, is ‘the philosophical life’.

I think the good life is achieving satisfaction. What satisfaction entails differs among individuals, and to the same individual among circumstances and over time. When we experience the feeling of satisfaction from an acheivement or a sensation, our bodies and minds become accustomed and dulled to that sensation so we end up needing novel and/or increasingly intense stimulus. The means to achieving satisfaction differ depending on the desire. Philosophy helps us know the world and know ourselves so that we can guide our actions more effectively towards the acheivement of our satisfaction. If philosophy is a satisfying end in itself, it will still entail a restless inquiry towards new insight, or else the orientation of the individual will shift towards other tasks which achieve satisfaction.

What do you think exemplifies the good life, and for what reason(s)? Do you think knowledge of the good life is objectively discoverable, or something that differs among individuals?

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The good life is different for each person, otherwise we would not be individuals.

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“If you want to improve something, learn to measure it.”

We all know that what is good for, either actually or merely perceived as, is different for different people, hence the persistent need for democracy and the authority distribution problem inherent in socialism. So to achieve “the good life” as a society, requires abstract, independent of specific details, thoughts that will lead to more specific and applicable societal designs that achieve a society built upon and sustaining “the good life”.

Abstractly, the best good possible, regardless of the individual involved is the “integral sum of joy over time”, IJOT, or “the greatest joy for the longest duration”. I don’t think that anyone can rationally argue against that premise. The question is how to achieve it considering the complexities of a realistic life. Joy is not easily objectively measured. But I can tell you that it is made of “the inner perception of progress toward a perceived goal”, even if that perception is false, misperception. Every time anyone feels joy, elation, satisfaction, happiness, or any of the other forms of positive emotion, it is due to that inner perception.

So to discover “the good life” first requires that a means to measure joy, even if crudely done, has to be discovered. For any one person, that is as easy as merely asking himself to what degree, perhaps on a scale of 1-100, he feels elated or joyous. And then by tracking the kinds of things that raise and lower that measure, one can begin to discern what kinds of things must be designed into and kept from a “good life”.

Among many people doing that, an abstraction can then be made that identifies the abstract kind of things that must occur to ensure a good life in general terms. And from those abstract things, one can then begin to identify particularities and specifics.

The whole venture can get pretty complex, but it all boils down to something pretty simple. The problem of course, as with anything, is getting anyone to believe it. The logic involved is abstract, complex, and detailed, somewhat mathematical. Most people won’t handle that even when they actually can. And that plays into the problem of actually establishing the good life even when it is known. The interaction with other people is a big part of a good life. And when other people are clueless as to how to accomplish a good life for themselves, they make it more difficult for others.

Thus that “good life”, although capable of being identified in abstract terms, is not possible to actually achieve until enough other people understand it as well. By enough people understanding it, it becomes both simple and easy to maintain, almost impossible to get rid of. So;

  1. Analyze and measure joy and the duration of it.
  2. Verify the theory concerning the abstract requirements
  3. Put it into private practice as much as the theory allows.
  4. Get anyone close to you to understand it for themselves as well.

From there on out, it grows quite automatically and establishes itself permanently. The issue of continued satisfaction, despite the propensity to become “bored with it” turns out to be a “red herring” that in effect keeps people from even trying to find it and remain lost in their dissatisfaction (which just happens, by no coincidence, to make specific other people very wealthy - their perception of “the good life”).

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The good life is what most people yearn for. It is one that’s almost indicative of the very nature of man, he turns toward the good life, as a sunflower turns toward it’s source of energy.

But there is a life which surpasses even good life. As the common saying goes, ‘aim high and hit the mark’, where trying for the best of all possible lives becomes the motive for an exemplary life. Here, the creme-de-la-creme of all lives is sought out and energized

Now cynics will point to this concept as fallible, because , they say, look around You, in the day to day hustle and bustle of this busy world, and it becomes hard to interpret it’s manyfold troubles, miseries, hypocrisies and delusions in light of the good life. They will observe, that the good life is nothing but an ill conceived joke put upon a few jokers trying to confuse the population, by predicating their own version of what they think it consists of.

 These do gooders, are nothing but Madison ave ad man, getting their take, from whoever profits by selling it.  

 So, if You proclaim to such flim flammers that You may not exactly believe their notion, thy will scuff you off with sly remarks and innuendoes and quickly exit from the conversation. Further, they will , soon enough start to backbite You, if you happen to have the bad luck of having daily intercourse with them, and spread untruths and abstract nonsense which may derail objectives you may have in mind in worthy, daily pursuits.

 So much for the search of the good life.  How much more challenging would seeking after the best life become vis a vis these obscurantists?  It would seem  become a project of varied and inscrutable complexity, leaving them cold and disgusted that any man would even begin to propose such a possibility.

 However, there is a life that is exemplary and most fulfilling.It is the life based on the solid foundation of faith. A belief in the highest of all possible powers, one which can only be gathered from the hidden recesses of the soul.  And friends, it takes a Mesiter Eckhart type realization, to be able to go there, a dark night, where the soul is illuminated from a source so rich, so full of it's self, (in the good way) that everything else around fades by comparison, including any version of the good life.  This life, is the total resignation of every sense of what previously has been thought of as good, it accedes to the total poverty of the soul, a relinquishing of all except that which can be of service, an emptying of even the most humble concern for the self, an abdication even of the search for that source.
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The good life is fucking as many whores as possible before breakfast, and then eating salami and drinking wine. Have you ever had more than one whore in your room? Four, is my record and I had intercourse with two of them while the other watched. That is good, and spaghetti is good if it’s cooked right with meatballs. And also, there something good about sausage, and cinnamon. What? Why did I way that? That is for old ladies. No the good life is a sailboat.

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Spoken like a true poet.

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There are some different answers put up here now. I might wonder whether the answer given by barbarianhorde, though seemingly satirical, does reflect an inclination towards either joy, as given by James, or else satisfaction, or a combination of the two. Or do you think they reflect some other state?

obe, does your proposition of faith, to your mind, go beyond either joy or satisfaction. For example, if one experienced connection with “the highest of all possible powers”, would that experience be something beyond or other than joy?

James S, so you’ve swapped my satisfaction for joy, which is understandable, joy is a more elated feeling than satisfaction. If there was a bar to measure the feelings, I think it would be safe to say that satisfaction would be lower down on a scale between joy and dejection.

I have a couple of questions, since I think your surmise comes closest to mine, but adds something more in the form of a program by which one can begin to ascertain the feeling of joy.

Do you think that every individual is capable of feeling the highest peak of joy, even if perhaps they haven’t yet known it? Or, to put it differently and which connects with my next questions below, do you think what is considered joy, a feeling of elated happiness, is possible for every person, or does disposition play a factor? (The reason I wonder, which is another question, is, do you think where people “set the bar” (for what they believe is exemplary of the good or best life) is a result of their disposition, or perhaps something else, that they have not perceived the truth, for example?)

Just to be sure for my own sake, do you think that what people believe to be either joy or satisfaction changes on occassions. Can what might be joy to one person be satisfaction to another, and what could be satisfaction to one be joy to another, or what is satisfaction to one person on one occassion be joy on another, and vice versa, or is each category stable?

Do you believe in relative happiness (that a person can feel less happy as a result of awareness of a state which is happier)? If so, do you think that measuring your levels of joy and coming up with less than perfect or even substantially high could result in a lowering of joy, when perceived relatively?

Those considerations aside, I think I am inclined to agree that even if a life of pure satisfaction could be called the good life, by relation, a life of pure joy would take precedent as the best life.

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First, what I am calling “joy” is the general property of good emotional feeling that ranges from zero to infinity, much like your height. Many people use different words for different degrees as though being 3 feet tall was a different thing than being 5 feet or 7 feet tall. Satisfaction, happiness, elation, bliss, and such are all merely different degrees of “Joy” (in the way that I am meaning it).

And certainly everyone is at every moment in a different position (or disposition) on that scale. The abstract cause of Joy is the same for everyone (inner perceived progress, “inner perceived hope being reached”), but obviously the triggers are very different simply because what is perceived as progress is different. And that even happens within a single mind bringing about internal dissonance and “mixed emotions”.

As far as everyone being able to “feel the highest peak of joy”, that is like everyone being able to reach the highest peak of tallness or intelligence. There really isn’t a “highest peak” other than what can be obtained under particular circumstances. And of course, those circumstance change and thus their ability changes as does their perception of which situation would constitute “progress toward a hope”. The hopes themselves change with learning and situations. But the sensation relating to Joy is always from that same “inner perception of progress to whatever hope is being held at that moment”.

IJOT is the maximum possible hope because it is a measure of the maximum possible joy over the maximum possible time. Thus to perceive your own IJOT increasing is itself a sensation of joy and thus self-perpetuating, yet still limited by that perception, (much like watching yourself watch yourself watching yourself - there is only so much that you can perceive.).

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Faith is a very difficult state to attain, i suspect, and it is far more than can be experienced through joy and satisfaction. Some of these i have read from the book of saints, and some i have based on my own journey toward the goal of becoming one with my intrinsic goal in life, which at this point is the gradual identifying with the sacred. I do not mean sacred to mean the usual religiosity, of adhering to traditional conceptions, but of the guiding power, which i have experienced in life at various turning points,where it served as the last and final agency to turn my life around. At other times, it was an internal dialogue, a gestation period, of which there was very little awareness initially, but later became an effective agent.

The joyful anticipation of that kind of feeling state, is not localized in the self at this point and seems to animate from outside in. The ordinary joy we experience for the occasional outbursts of pleasure, or reunion, of lack, are turned around here, and although there is a warm sensation in the center of the body, the source of it is external, and as soon as that appears, it passes, and there then a connection appears, which has neither location or specific personal source. It is a general state of self diffusion, a momentary relief from the constrains imposed by the context within which a life is lived in duration.

These moments are short, but in that short time, an eternity seems to be looming, a kind of hidden answer, that it is good. It is these moments of brief suspension of the painful apprehension of the dark side of life, when that source is identified as a central source of power.

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An interesting note. Although I could comment, I suspect that my input would not help much in your individual case (seldom does in anyone’s case).

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That is nothing but the outburst of naive and misguided youth.

with love,
sanjay

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[b]The very important point that most of the people use to miss regarding joy, peace or happiness is that in 99% cases, it depends on others.

A commom person cannot feel joy alone ever, excluding some exceptions like Buddha. The trick to have more peace and happiness in life is to keep your surroundings at peace and happy, including people around you. That is why our ancestors established the practice of close-nitted family of blood relations.

Wealth/facilities does not necessarily bring more joy, though they make life easy. But, at the end of the day, all is useless unless one does not have some others to share. The cornerstone of the joy is to own someone and be owned by someone[/b].

with love,
sanjay

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:text-yeahthat:

“Anentropic Harmony” - harmony within and immediately around. Nature has been succeeding with it for millions of years. One would think that Man could learn.

It would help if people stopped merely running from their discomfort fear and try running toward their comfort and hope.

Fear scatters (the the heart and mind)
Hope gathers (the heart and mind)

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“Therefore you see those old scholars running after recognition in a ridiculous and undignified manner. They are offended if their name is not mentioned, cast down if another one says the same thing in a better way, irreconcilable if someone alters their views in the last. Go to the meetings of scholars and you will see them, these lamentable old men with their great merits and their starved souls famished for recognition and their thirst which can never be met. The soul demands your folly, not your wisdom.” Jung

Paul exclaimed, "Where is the wise man? Where is the scholar? Where is the philosopher of this age? Has not God made foolish the wisdom of the world? (1 Cor. 1:20, 21, NIV).

“Most rarely align with their true power, because it seems illogical to them that there is power - power in relaxation, in letting go, in love, in joy, or in bliss. Most people do not understand their true power lies in releasing resistance- which is the only obstacle to their true power.” Jung

Joy is the power in letting go.

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One of the very few things that I have hear Jung say that is worth hearing.

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we are all buddhas because he was not crucified, if you meet him on the road, kill him.

’ Dionysus, -

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The Artful Pauper

Creativity, productivity, meaningful self-fulfillment. For what reasons: why else have we been created?

Objectively? I’m not sure since as they say: Beauty is in the eye of the beholder - so also is the “good life” and the “best life”. It would be different to a hedonist as opposed to a stoic or epicurean.

It is subjectively discovered in the present moment or flowing moment through our sense of wonderful qualia, our sense of “being there” and our sense of well-being.

Perhaps it can be “objectively” discovered also by looking at how certain others “live their life, respond to life” how that living forms and transforms the person, causes him to thrive and shine.

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Dr. evil over here.

I bet you have never been in that position even.

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I do not want to be in that position either. Keep it for yourself. I am pretty satisfied with whatever i have.

with love,
sanjay