The place of fear in politics

What place should fear have in politics?

What freedoms should we be afraid of losing? What freedoms should we be afraid of allowing? How much fear-based governance should we permit?

If we were not living in a fear based culture, government would be unnecessary.

What makes a fearful culture? I think we have to connect fear immediately to politics and what it means: power, intimidation, punishment, threats. Is this not how order is established?

What place ought fear to have in our political culture?

(Should we really be afraid of this question…?)

Fear is necessary. If we hadn’t been afraid of the axis powers in WW2, things might not have gone the same way. On the other hand, you can’t just go around instilling fear as a matter of diplomacy. This would be uncivil.
As far as the question of what types of freedoms we should and shouldn’t allow, there’s a good article called “two concepts of liberty” by a guy named Isaiah Berlin that says alot about this. It could be worth checking out.

So you’re saying fear startles: it can clarify our perspective and cause us to react appropriately to a threat. As you note, it’s at least as likely for fear to turn us into crisis-oriented, paranoid aggressors.

Are we still free if we’re afraid?

We can still be free if we’re afraid. As long as we have the power to control the particular situation.

I don’t think fear is necessary in society at all and frankly I believe it is a bit over played.

I am firm believer in cooperation. ( You might know it better as socialism.)

Fear should have no place in politics.

Rather than ask what freedoms we should fear losing, I would ask what freedom have we lost. We are not free in a governing body that owns our citizenship.

It is refutable that without the control enforced upon society, the society will descend into anarchy. While this is undeniably true, it should be the duty of the people to control themselves. If they are unable, they are not a part of society, and thus should be exiled from it. SEND THEM TO THE MOON!

It seems to me that fear is part of life. Fear cannot be taken out of any activity.

What you’re getting at is how should people be motivated and negative vs. positive reinforcement. Should politicians scare people into doing what they want or should they inspire them with hope to do what they want?

To that, I’d say whatever the politician desires. If they desire to inspire with fear rather than hope, that’s their choice. The people need to decide which they prefer.

Agreed.

The government is supposed to provide mutual aid for it’s citizens by cooperation instead of things we call fear. I believe that is what they call ethics a term hardly ever spoke of in the same sentence of government.

What place should fear have in politics?

None. Although most fear that we see now is not because the evil leaders pump it out, it’s because we the people are not educated enough, which is mainly their own fault. Someone mentioned Sir Isaiah Berlin, one of his claims is that you can’t force people to be free and what happens if they are, yet ask many people about Iraq. One of the first things they say is that they (Iraq) have gained their freedom from that. After reading the concept of two liberties, you can pretty much see what’s happening in Iraq.

“I am firm believer in cooperation. ( You might know it better as socialism.)”

The right wing – left wing battle is a myth. The real battle is liberty verses tyranny. Socialism and Fascism are one and the same, i.e. take away peoples’ liberties for the good of the state. We shouldn’t get caught in the trap that Bush is right wing therefore bad. Bush, Blair etc… are bad because they want to take away peoples’ freedoms using fear and other methods.

Government doesn’t tell people what to do, that kind of system would not last long. Instead they changes peoples’ environments or as said use fear and peoples’ ignorance. Then we get to the point where big brother is good because it protects us. That kind of thinking has only come about in the last 10 years.

churches, not government, provide aid and charity.

seperation of church and state remember?

[size=200]VIVA LA REVOLUTION!!![/size]

-Imp

Big time dialectic, absolutely: Socialism and souless capitalism are two sides of the same one world dominion coin.

For a more detailed modern history perspective:

http://www.reformation.org/wall-st-hitler.html

http://www.reformation.org/wall-st-bolshevik-rev.html

http://www.reformation.org/wall-st-fdr.html

Yah, but they have to get people to agree that what they think will aid the people are the correct things. For example, if you think that free healthcare is best for the people, you need to explain why? When you exlpain why you have to give them the consequences if free healthcare isn’t available. Those consequences, if you truly believe free healthcare is good, will be scary to you and you’ll likely feel the need to share that fear with others. That fear you share will in turn make the people scared cause they’ll see your scary vision of the world without free healthcare.

Do you get what I am saying? In order to prevent someone from doing something that hurts them, sometimes you have to scare them by letting them know what can happen if they do it.

Fear is what makes the world tick, really, but so does fun and pleasure. They’re two sides of the coin. I think what you want to say is that gov’t shouldn’t use fear as a way to manipulate or control for the interest of the gov’t. They should use it for the good of the people.

For the good of the people, what does that mean? I’m sure Bush, Hilter etc… all think/thought they were acting for the good of the people. I would be surprised if they think they themselves are bad people.

I agree that fear is used, to explain free health care etc… I disagree why. The main reason is that most people are in a state of rational ignorance. If the government were to release a white paper explaining the benefits and then the opposition the negatives, how many people would read it? I would guess only geeks like me, sections of the media and some politicians. The people would complain that they don’t know about it. It’s rational that they don’t know about, if you watch TV in your spare time, chances are you won’t read about politics. The peoples environment has changed and so too have the people. As you said we “share fear” to make people agree. That sums it up.

For example:

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Northwoods

Operation Nortwoods is not a conspiracy but has been proven using CIA documents.

ALL TERROR EVENTS, allow inept leaders to go before the public and pretend to be strong and “leaderly,” to the terrorized masses. Allegedly under attack, victimized by their own propagandized news organizations, the people seek the protection of their fearless leader, and their government, and embrace them both readily. Helped along by continual doses of hysterical propaganda from the media.

I was responding to Joker’s comment that the government is suppose to ‘provide mutual aid’ to the people. My point was based on his position and I paraphrased his terms with ‘good of the people’.

I don’t make any claims to know what the government should or should not do. I was letting Joker know that if he did believe that was the role of the government, they would still have to scare people to do that.

I’m thinking about two concepts of liberty by Isaiah Berlin. We have fear of government repression, and we have fear of government neglecting us. We need both the “freedom to”, and the “freedom from” they sort of depend on one another. Someone help me sort this out. I’m sure there’s more to it than that.

Obviously its a hard decision
1.Give goverment power to protect. but at what cost? Once they are given the power we lose it as the people. Its a matter of trust. Problem is i dont Trust my Goverment.

2.No goverment Reinforcement, High risk of Vulnerability of attack. We couldnt defend ourselves. I personally dont think local Militia is going to withstand Chinas full force Military.

The only possible solution i have thought of is to Make the Goverments action 100% public. Nothing goes without being know about.
But once agian at what cost? If the general public knows then the enemy will know as well. So what can you do?

Tell you what im doing. Im buying an Island. In some Desolate remote location. But iv already started a thread on that.

It’s like any relationship I think. It’s give and take.