Writing something directly from an encyclopedia, for example, never meant that what was being copied and presented as ‘work’ was being learned and understood. Again, people were just providing what was being expected of and from them.
But, as always, and like I was getting to, people might learn and understand more from just copying ‘that way’, like they could when they just use ‘artificial intelligence’. They might, for example, just read what artificial intelligent “said” and learn and understand more from that, then they ever learned and understood from a “teacher” just ‘dribbling’ on, from their perspective.
Was it a problem also when “students” used encyclopedias?
If yes, then why?
But, if no, then why not?
Artificial intelligence does not hide itself.
What is this obsession with “plagiarism” among the adult population?
If someone says or writes something that is actually worthy of repeating, then everyone should just repeat it anyway.
Adults have this constant obsession with wanting to be recognised for what are essentially just thoughts only. And, LOL the worst part is that thought or those thoughts only arose because of that body’s past experiences, only, and not because ‘that person’ was more intelligent than any other person is.
If anyone expresses absolutely anything that is important to ‘the world’, then it would be much better repeated without naming the individual who expressed it first. To want to be known and recognised for something like that goes to show just how shallow and insecure that person really was.
Who cares?
This kind of attitude shows just how little these people had really ‘grown up’.
They were like babies still wanting and needing attention.
“Oh, I said that, so recognise me and how great i am”.
But, like in Life, Itself, there is absolutely nothing complex here. Why do you believe that there is anything complex here?
EVERY child.
EVERY young child obviously just prefers to study willingly mostly different things that you adults want and expect them to study.
See, they have not yet been indoctrinated to believe that money and work are “necessary” things in Life. So, they like to study, willingly, what is actually fun and enjoyable in Life, and really what is actually necessary to Life and living.
Also, why did you use the words "without any guidance by “parents and teachers”?
Obviously, all children want guidance from adults. They obviously want guidance regarding what is necessary, and done in an enjoyable guided way. They certainly do not want so-called “guidance” in ‘the way’ that is done through the so-called “education system”.
OBVIOUSLY.
Only an absolute fool not want to play and enjoy life and living.
Also, and let us not forget, all children want to and do study naturally, but again they do this naturally in a playful fun and enjoyable way, and so want it ‘that way’, naturally.
All children are naturally born to wonder, study, and learn. The ‘current’ “education system” sadly though breeds this out of chidren. As the ‘current’ “educational system” is designed to create believers in the ‘monetary system’ and thus to create “slavers” for ‘that system’.
Here is another prime example of one who has been so indoctinated into the cult that it is in that it is following and abiding by the ‘law’ of ‘that system and cult’.
If children are NOT following and copying the adults of the ‘monetary cult and system’, and NOT following and abiding by the ‘laws’ of ‘this cult system’, then they do not have ‘self-discipline’.
LOL In Life, children do NOT need discipline. It is you adults who need the ‘self-discipline’ to learn how to teach children what is Right in Life.
LOL ‘This one’ actually believes children NEED ‘self-discpline’ to want to go to ‘school’ and study what the “education system” wants and expects them to learn.
Which is essentially to ‘grow up’ to be a believer that money solves and fixes all problems and that you need to work to obtain money so that you can live and true and proper life.
LOL, LOL, LOL “overused”.
LOL Using an encylopedia could be considered “lazy”. Using a calculator could be considered “lazy”. Using a compter and the internet could be considered “lazy”. LOL They could all be considered as being “overused” as well.
How much knowledge that you ‘currently have now’ have have you come to on your own?
How much of it did you obtain from other sources, including “teachers”?
Be honest, how much of it did you come to on your lonesome?
Were you being “lazy” by using other sources?
In fact, is there absolutely any knowledge that you can put forth here that you arrived on your very own before absolutely anyone else did?
If no, then why were you “so lazy” and just obtained it all from other people, and thus from other sources?
But, if yes, then what knowledge have to you come to before absolutely anyone else had?
It could be argued that just about as much effort is put to asking artificial intelligence for the answer to a question as is pushing the buttons on a calculator is, or looking in an encyclopedia or other written text is.
Look, if you adults want “students” or children to find answers by “themselves” only, then,
Why do you people not start doing the exact same thing?
Stop making and improving written texts, encyclopedias, calculators, computers, the internet and artificial intelligence FOR them, and “yourselves”.
Remember that they also copy and follow what you adults do. Do you adults ask artificial intelligence for answers? Are you being “lazy” when you do this?
After “students” and children find answers all on their lonesome, remind them not to say and write it down absolutely anywhere, as then this would make it “too easy” for others to find ‘the answers’ as well. Remember, if anyone could find ‘those answers’ anywhere, then those who do that are being “lazy”, and not putting “the effort” in.
OF COURSE. What ‘idiot’ would not want to just ‘the grade’ to pass the course that they are being forced to endure through?
People ‘want to pass’ because they do not want to be humiliated, ridiculed, and/or punished for ‘not passing’. This is how the so-called “education system” works.
Oh no, “students” are use so-called “cheating mechanisms” to just ‘get through’ what they do not even want to be doing, obviously.
Is this some kind of new piece of information that is just coming to light?
Only a complete fool or idiot would want to follow and copy what the abusive cult system that is enforcing them to be in wants.
Obviously, the smart ones will use so-called “cheating mechanisms” to bypass the abusive system that is trying to encapsulate and/or enslave them.
Some smarter ones just leave ‘that system’ entirely, and then start businesses, instead of being a slave to ‘the system’. But, they had still become fools, as they were indoctrinated to be some of the biggest believers of ‘the system’. They just weren’t stupid enough to be enslaved to working for ‘the system’. They use ‘the system’ for their own personal advantage.
Does this generalisation go for all people that you claim do not use them directly as adults, or for only some?
I know. They are there to make you follow ‘the system’.
All cults and systems have ‘courses’, so that ‘the ones’ in it learn to follow ‘the system’.
Unfortunately, ‘the system’ that you are referring to here FORCES unsuspecting children into it. Who end up so-called ‘growing up’ into adults who end up believing and fighting for ‘the system’, like you are doing and showing here.
Are you able to explain why, from an ‘objective perspective’?
I haven’t been arguing that point. I think there is a reasonable concern that AI use is reducing people’s thinking for themselves, this is part of technology replacing our capacities in a variety of ways. I’m more concerned about AIs use by governments as part of sophisticated surveillance, taking that last word extremely broadly. I also think the tech going rogue is a real threat. But that’s all an entirely different subject.
I think there’s a lot of truth in that. Typical university pedagogy is terrible and has been for a long time. I wouldn’t be upset if AI gets them to throw out essay writing. I went into some suggestion earlier in the thread for what could replace them. Of course, this may well be cosmetic. I’m more on the deschooling of society/apprentice end of pedagogy politics.
The sentence is sarcastic. For example, the Ivy League univerities in the US, which think of themselves and are often thought of by others, as finer (better, more refined, pedagogically sophisticated and so on)
In both cases it depends on how they use them. If they copied from the encyclopedias that was a problem. It would be easier to see they were doing that however.
Should they know what it means? Is copy pasting a good way to show expertise, especially if you don’t know what you are repeating?
I don’t really care about the person who said it getting credit actually.
You seem to be assuming this is the only concern with plagiarizing.
More assumptions about what was meant with no clarifying questions before condemnation.
And, let us not forget that ‘adults’ made it, to sell, and then, conveniently, ‘try to’ blame “students”, usually children, for the misuse or overuse of it.
If adults do not want “students” using artificial intelligence’ as a “cheating mechanism” then do not introduce it in society. And, do not use it “yourselves”, but, unfortunately, you people are so easily and simply able to be indoctrinated that you do not just end up using it “yourselves” you idiots actually go out and pay for it. Thus, giving ‘the ones’ with the majority of the money in the world even more of “your money”.
Which, again, is absolutely hilarious to watch play out here.
Yet the very thing artificial intelligence is based upon is the ‘current’ human knowledge and intellect anyway.
it does this, but so too have schools, “teachers”, theologians, and science.
Human beings are naturally lazy and free creatures, so they will use whatever, which helps free them up. But, for those who do still want to learn and understand more, then they will continue to study, think, and think critically. Which, by the way, all young children do naturally anyway. That is; until they start copying and following the adults who do not.
In regard to what exactly?
VERY, VERY True.
LOL As history has shown and proved, whenever people introduce the slightest shred and spark of an individual new thought, which shines a light on the “masses” beliefs, then that one is shun.
Nothing much different, but just speed the process up.
Some people ‘today’ have already started speaking and saying things like, “artificial intelligence said [this or that] …”, as though because ‘artificial intelligence’ said it, it must be true and right.
‘artificial intelligence’ is the new “priest” or “preacher”, or new “scientist”, “teacher” or “leader”. If ‘they’ say it, or it is written in ‘their books’, then it must be true and right.
The beauty of ‘this system’ dying out completely, and being buried and put to rest fully, is that the ‘new way’ can and will begin. ‘The way’ that everyong wants and desires anyway, by the way.
Do they? Why do people think like that, and what do they mean by ‘finer’, if you do not want to inform ‘us’ of what ‘you’ mean by ‘finer’?
More ‘refined’ than ‘what’, exactly?
Why and how exactly?
What so-called “problem” could there be if, for example, they were actually learning and understanding more from using them? (Obviously, from the way you are defining the ‘problem’ word here).
And, what does it matter if is easier to see if they were using encyclopedias or artificial intelligence?
By just seeing that they used something else never shows exactly what they have learned and understood or not. Which is what the whole supposed ‘issue’ here is it not?
But this has no relevance to what the word ‘plagiarism’ means and/or refers to, does it not?
you introduced the ‘plagarism’ word here. Were you using that word in reference to whether “students” know what ‘it’ means?
Who cares if ‘they’ are learning and/or understanding more?
How would you know if ‘they’ are learning or understanding more or not?
Why then did you introduce the ‘plagiarism’ word here for?
After all, that is what ‘that word’ essentially means or implies correct?
What other so-called ‘concerns’ are there with the word ‘plagiarising’?
And, why did you seem to assume what you did here?
Yes, I remember. And I notice that when I point out you hijack threads and take things off topic, suddenly you are responding on topic and after me to remain on topic. Great.
What about human rights?
What do you want to say about those in relation to AI use in writing essays?
So, every child wants to study willingly, but at the same time every child prefers playing than studying. You are full of contradictions.
As usual, every clueless person blames “the system”. What this system is does not matter, we just have something to accuse. According to your logic, the school is some kind of “system” imposed by the adults to diverge the kids from the “truth”.
Now, can you please inform us, how many kids have managed to get higher level of education outside of a “school system”? Do you actually believe that Wikipedia type sites are capable of providing the necessary knowledge on a topic? Or a kid will become a doctor by watching youtube videos and asking AI arbitrary questions?
Generalizations so far have been made by you. Are you responding to your own comments when replying?
With regard to ‘objective perspective’, there is no point to answer. I have repeatedly mentioned in this forum that I do not believe in objectivity. No need to return back to this.
Modern academia uses the “paper writing process” as a means of:
Identity maintenance through constant quotation that preserves said identity.
Censorship as a filter to ideas that question the identity of what is being taught.
Thought formation through assertion of writing styles, ie the means of reasoning, to instill the identity of academia as the means of reasoning determines the perceptions of those who practice said means.
Potential funding through derivation of ideas in accordance to mainting points 1, 2 and 3 where points 1, 2, 3 lead up to 4 (A cycle). This derivation of ideas is the financial model of academia, money through abstractions.
Having studied in academia, barring stem majors in a small degree, the priority is “thought formation” synonymous to brainwashing. Academia, while having some benefits, is primarily a factory for thought, with factory being the appropriate analogy given the mechanize approach to knowledge.
AI, is and will, neuter academia. Academia will still exist but its power will substantially fade.
I put what I meant by ‘finer’ in parentheses in that post.
Yes.
Ah, you noticed that I explained what it meant to me. More refined than other institutions of higher education.
Easier to see if they were formulating things themselves or copy/pasting.
Not human rights???
Anyway. If they can formulate their own arguments and positions there is a much better chance they understand the field they are in better. I think the essay writing evaluation is a poor one, which I went into elsewhere in the thread, but if you have it, I think it is better the student actually writes the essay, rather than getting a machine or another person to write it.
Know the subject of the class or program they are taking yes. That has been the main focus of my response to the OP. I never mentioned any concern about people who first said X, getting credit for X.
That is a good question. I made some suggestions for better ways to evaluate their knowledge and skills in an area, if one keeps a similar university/college structure of learning. I’d prefer more radical changes, but within that system I think there are better ways to evaluate students to see if they should pass the course and get to enter roles based on them having those roles.
Thats so natural that its pointless to be concerned by. Its as obvious as the presence of air.
If you can breathe, then the government is hard at work to make your life unbearable.
You are talking about the people who are currently mass murdering europe because they think its economically and socially more beneficial to have another third world instead of the thousand year old cultures present in europe.
I will be frank.
There will only ever be normalcy returning on this front and in this regard, when politicians and their families will be gutted, slit open from neck to abdomen, and their carcasses are thrown onto the street.
Not before.
The times when the government was afraid of its people, are long past. They view people as less than animal. Something they can very much literally shit over and then shrug with a smirk and walk off onto the sunset.
You will be held to standards by which you will be sent to prison for stealing a hundred euro, meanwhile trash in tricky suits are playing around with millions and billions on a daily basis both money and lives, lose it and nothing happens to them. Less than nothing. A tax payer funded retirement is waiting for them.
Unless actual, very literal fear is bought back. Unless these scum are humbled to their core.
The situation about your rights and just in general the government’s attitude towards it’s people, will never change for the better.