# TIME is mans measure of change

Time does not infact exist, a bold statement you may think however it is correct.
Time only exists in the sense that today my hair is length A and tomorow it will be length B. Time is really just mans measure of change. A way of understanding all the changes we see around us. If the world is infinate then time cannot exist. When did time exist? Many people ask this, it began when man was able to think.
I see no reasonable argument against my theory.

You’re saying that time is the events of matter. But presumably there were events of matter prior to man.

I would agree that time - as a concept useful in defining the events of matter - didn’t arrive until man began to think.

You will find that many will agree with this thread. It has been discussed before, but you didn’t know that because you are obviously new to ILP. Welcome, anyhow, if you were not already welcomed.

On one level time is nothing more than a measurement. But is it because of our consciousness that time is perceived to be linear?

This would mean that distance is an illusion too. If some point A is related to some point B, and point B is related to some point C, and we are related to all three points, then information sent from A to all its related points, and then from B to all its related points and so on, should result in information propagating to us from point C simultaneously with A. That is, because an observation is a response to information received, A B& C would appear to be one thing. The information would be simultaneously present at all points and it would mean nothing to say that the information came from A.

It would be shortcutting things to introduce the idea of state at point B, so that information at C would be a function of information from A and the state of B, and the state of point B a function of information from A, because we have no mechanism without time for devising a memory at B.

However, if the information transferred to B was a function of information transferred from B,and vice versa. that is, if there was simultaneous interference, then the value at point B would be an infinite sequence of values.

I guess to say that "time doesn’t exist" is one of those whacky statements which define their terms in order to be trivially true.

In this case, if the implied referent of time is an actual "line"or invisible thread, tugging along the universe, then of course it doesn’t exist. Neither does a meter, or a number. And yet we don’t say that meters and 3’s "don’t exist." They are realized in the world in different ways, to be sure, but they are useful concepts, which have their own brand of existence.

Nothing can be more clear than the fact that the referent of our word "time" which can be defined as "that which permits change" does exist.

In the case of numbers, there is some debate whether numbers are timeless ideas and existed before humans ever realized them, or whether they are human constructions.

However, there can be no such debate about time. The referent of the word "time" is a necessary factor anytime something changes. To say that nothing changed before someone recognized it first is absurd and contradictory.

I don’t see how you have any ground to stand on.

Im not new to this forum, i have used it previously to argue about animal rights and the non existance of god. but it has been along time since ive been on it. Im now a philosophy student.

Events can pass without the persons knowledge of it. The past and present are only theory based off of experiance. We judge the past by memory, and the future by the experiances we have gained in the past.

The common definition of time is that of measurement. It is used to measure the linear pattern of events. We can use it to referance back to certain points in history. Time also passes different because of our objectivity. We are emotional, and this effects our abilities to percieve time. Perhaps a being of pure intelligence could be able to accurately measure time.

[center]
The Nature of

[size=200]Time.
[/size]

[size=75]So raise a cheer to those forgotten years
Back to the corner where we went our
separate ways

Now the carnival is goin’ home
The ferris wheel is spent
For those rovin’ years of endless jeers
Have dried all that was left

Calm the ocean breeze
Quiet the raging sea
This stormy ship we sail
Is a bottle filled with rage
Chorus to â€œThe Wanderlustâ€ By Flogging Molly[/size]
[/center]

Time has always been a subject that fascinated me. There are so many questions about time. What speed does time move at? Does time have a framerate? Does the past exist? Does the future exist? Do we exist in all points in time simultaneously? The answers:
We donâ€™t really know. We could never discover the speed of time or the framerate of time, because we, thusly our tools, would be constricted, and must therefore be lower than that speed. We cannot determine that the future exists until it becomes the past. We cannot even tell if the past exists.
The conclusion:
Time, as we know it, must be a lie.

Nowâ€¦ this must sound more than a little strange, what with it assuming that everything we know is wrong and all, but give it some thought. Time is, in a fashion similar to God, unproveable, and therefore impossible to disprove as well. Whether we realize it or not, in our minds there always exist two kinds of time.
Even in a movie where one timetravels, we describe it in a way that displays these two times. â€œâ€First he traveled to the past to solve a problem in the present, and then he went back to a future.â€ The first type of time there, is naturally the past, present, and future mentioned. The second, is the time that exists within the â€œâ€first, then.â€ No matter what we do we cannot escape time. Why? Because time is in us. We define time.
Time is, in a sense, like math. It is true, but it is only true because we are there to prove it such through logic, yet another invention of human origin.
This explains the â€œgood old daysâ€ effect. Because the past exists in our minds, we have time to embellish memory. To embellish thought.

Past and future are theory. Past is based off memory that is distorted in the minds of the human, and the future is speculation. And from the physics perspective, time does exist.

Time is a measurement of our planets rotations, and revolutions around the sun.

And blackholes where time is supposed to not exist. .

In human context time is a measurment of our planets revolutions around the sun, yet there are many suns and many planets in our infinite universe therefore our concept of time is flawed.

If we all except that time is infact change, or a measure of it, then can we say it is possible to travel in time. If we hault our own physical change and then start it again then we will be in the future. Does that mean that to go back in time we must speed up our changes. If slowing down our changes sends us to the future, does speeding them up send us to the past? I have once heard a theory that if a machine was to travel into space faster than the speed of light and back to earth it would infact be the past. Is this true?

Ok someone needs to say this sooner or later so I’ll just say it:

Space is time.

There can be no time in a black hole because space doesn’t really exist in the way we know it ‘in’ a black hole. Gravity/matter and time seem to converge at this point and any explanation of what happens (as of right now) I would think… is purely speculative.

This is why if you were to travel beyond the speed of light to somewhere else in the galaxy and then come back… earth may have aged like 80 years, but you’d feel like maybe 2 days had gone by. Because you’re not traveling to another place in space… you’re travelling to another place in space-time. It’s what the people on star trek are always talking about.

So I mean… yeah time is the observation of change for a person… that time isn’t exactly the same as the person next to him though. Hmm… a non galactical example could be something like… if you take 2 infallible watches and sync them while next to each other, the time’s will actually change from each other’s previously identical one… if you were to take one to the bottom of the ocean… and one to the top of mount everest. – Only slightly… but they would.

I dunno… a science guy can probably tackle this better than I.

That was a good explination… obviously this change occurs within the space, what is a blackhole compared to space? Is it nothing? Because i dont belive that nothing can exist…

Well… that’s a pretty good question.

The gravity in a black whole becomes so immense that noone really knows what’s going on in there… gravity is one of those concepts we haven’t really understood too well as of yet.

So… I don’t really know

time existed from the time we Humans ordered nature and therefore our lives.

north

infinity = something very big. there is not a point of infinity, you know that right?

time is periodic change more precisely in physics. when a pendulum swings from one maximum to the opposite we say a second has passed.

time never occurs independant of motion. to believe in the existence of time is similar to belief in mind body dualism. no one knows what the mind is except that it never occurs independant of the body. thus to infer independant existence of the body is absurd.

Time is change

i’m not sure of your point here.

but can you imagine change without movement???