Verbatim quotes of Jesus in the Bible

How did the authors of Luke, Matthew & Mark know precisely what Jesus said? Did Jesus have followers who documented every one of his sayings - right down to the word?

It strikes me as a little bit odd that there are so many verbatim quotes of Jesus in the Bible. Who documented precisely what Jesus said and why was it documented?

The quotes in the bible that you are reading are not verbatim, they’ve been translated. So by definition, any quote that you are reading in an english bible is not a verbatim quote.

Jesus might have said something like that.

Even if they’ve been translated, the detail to which the quotes exist in the Bible strongly suggests someone documented everything Jesus said at the time he said it. Who documented it and why was it documented?

i’m not aware of any definitive proof that the jesus you’re speaking of ever existed at all, even as a non-holy human.

I know i’m gonna get responses to this like “it was recorded!” and stuff like that. well, there are also those who say that there are no proven records of his existence as well. there are also arguments that the bureaucracy of the Romans would not have left out something like his trial and crucifixion – which they apparently have no record of as well.

but i dont know that these records dont exist. i also dont know that they do exist. which is why i only say that i’m not aware of any definitive proof. not that no such proof exists.

are you aware of such a proof?

I’ve told you before; study anthropology.
Your question is immediately unfounded on the most basic levels of anthropological inquery.

You state a question that assumes first century authorship works anything like today without ever looking to see how that culture functioned in publication and circulation.

You don’t have any proof that any science experiment ever actually took place either. You have faith in the gossip and fascination publications of others, other who have proven to be extremely political with serious exaggeration tendencies.

Historians have more archeological evidence for the existence of Jesus than they do for George Washington.

I’m aware of no such proof that Jesus ever existed. But does this mean he didn’t? Likewise, I am not aware of any proof that George Washington ever existed.

However, the manner in which Christians respond when confronted with questions about Jesus or God strongly suggests that they have serious doubts about whether Jesus & God exist.

Ever been recruited by a multi-level marketing rep? They tell you all the great things about the business & how many people have made millions of dollars, but when you confront them with questions like, “how much money can I make?” or “how much money have you made?”, they’re very evasive. Next thing you know, the rep you spoke with is no longer in that business.

Christians state that God can do anything
Christians state that God knows everything
You and I both know that we can make unimpeded free will choices

Run the breakfast cereal choice scenario as described at http://www.ilovephilosophy.com/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=172636&start=100 and you’ll see that it is impossible for God to both know anything and be able to do anything.

Scientists claim that Special Relativity explains everything, but run through the Stopped Clock Paradox as described at http://www.ilovephilosophy.com/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=175032 and you will see that Special Relativity doesn’t work at all.

So what’s your point?
Idiots trying to teach idiots create idiosyncrasies?

Did you run through the breakfast cereal scenario?

No. Did you run through the Paradox?

I assumed it to have a high probability of being as mundane as this topic.

I sincerely hope that you question the words of Plato and Aristotle as much as you do the words of Jesus and Muhammad, just for the sake of you not being such a slave to your own bias towards religion.

I skimmed through the paradox, but it appears it would take at least 100 times as long to understand as it would to understand the breakfast cereal scenario.

Here it is:

[i]Let’s say on day 1, God knows you are going to choose to eat Cheerios for breakfast on day 3. God writes down on a piece of paper “Cheerios” for your breakfast choice for day 3. God sets up a camera which films the piece of paper. No one other than God sees what is written on the paper, but the camera keeps rolling. On day 1, you haven’t yet selected your breakfast for day 3. On day 3, you choose to eat Wheaties for breakfast. On day 4, you look at the piece of paper. If it says “Cheerios”, then you know God’s foreknowledge was wrong. If it says Wheaties, you check the film and see when the paper changed from “Cheerios” to “Wheaties”. It’s very simple.

Another way to look at it is to look at God’s knowledge and your choice for each of days 1, 2 & 3.
Day 1: God knows you’re going to eat Cheerios on day 3, while you haven’t yet made your choice
Day 2: Same as day 1
Day 3: God now knows that you ate Wheaties on day 3, as you have now made your choice.

Think of it this way. Let’s say God sends you a note every day in a sealed envelope. On the note it states what you’ll eat for breakfast on a given day. You are instructed to open the note for each day after you eat your breakfast on that day. For two months, you eat breakfast and then open the note. You observe that God correctly identified what you were going to eat for breakfast every day. Then one day you open the note for that day prior to eating breakfast and see that it says “Cheerios”. You choose to eat Wheaties that day. What does that do to God’s foreknowledge?[/i]

Mutcer,

Christians state, Christians state…

Look, Mormon Christians state that almost no one goes to hell, there are several layers of heaven, God evolved from a humanoid mundane form through virtue of spirit, that anyone can become like God through the same virtuosness and be tasked to watch over and nurture another world’s evolution, and that God lives on a planet that we have coordinates to.

Now the real heart of the matter isn’t what they think.
The real heart of the matter is what you think about existing.
I don’t really give a shit about what Christians think. I’ve had my cup with them at length and know my place with them.
I’m interested in your ontology; not theirs.

How do you feel about existing?

If you can’t understand that Paradox, what makes you think you can understand God?

Jayson explained your error sufficiently.
I can explain even more, but if you can’t get the arithmetic, what good is studying calculus?

What you would need to ask, if you were in that situation, is why you ran out of Wheaties and if you are going to be satisfied eating the Cheerios since you have no choice left.

As well as whether or not there is a way you would like to feel about it.

i am also interested in this question by jayson…

Are you saying that “God” is not objectively measured? That each person has their own “God” and that’s the correct definition of “God” for them?

How do I feel about existing? Be more specific with your question or try asking it with yes/no questions. It’s far too open-ended for me to provide you with an answer without potentially misleading you.