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A woman’s reply from another forum on this topic[/size]
quote:
Originally posted by matisse
LOL… oh man.
Jesus Christ… you sound like you have some serious issues.
Actually, you sound like a paedophile: “Once in a while I see a nice, natural girl, without tons of makeup that exudes inner and outer beauty. Fresh pink skin, clean, plain and nicely groomed hair and dressed neatly. No, she is not a hot babe if one judges them by current trends, but she exhibits her ‘hotness’ in a way that seems to be lost nowadays…freshness and wholesomeness.” Let me guess, you prefer women to be “brazilian waxed”. The less a woman appears to be an adult, the better for you, correct?
Males project their idealized image of how women should look then, when they are accommodated, turn around and attack that very same image. Maybe you should deal with your complaint that women (girls, in you world) aren’t fitting your image of how they should appear by changing yourself. This doesn’t seem to be the proper forum to air your personal sexual fantasies. You doi realize that “girls” refers to pre-pubescent females, that girls become women when they begin menstruation, right?
quote:
Now, I seldom get a chance to talk with these wholesome beauties, so I am judging them by externals. No doubt surface appearance is not reliable, and their inner beauty may not match their outer beauty, but at least it is a start in the right direction.
The “right” direction meaning the direction of your choice.
One would think sex addicts have plenty to work on within themselves before complaining about others. Men who need porn to stimulate themselves sexually have deeper problems then how women should appear. Addiction is not being able to get enough of what you really don’t want. Maybe you should look at that too.
Incidentally, since you are also an over-eater, you might think about referring to areas of the anatomy by their proper name instead of using food substitutions like “cup cakes”.
You remind me of the dark side of self-esteem.
*********** REPLY SEPARATOR ***********
V writes:
Thank you for your reply matisse.
Girls? I just refer to young women as girls. Hell, I call my wife ‘my girl’ once on awhile. If my use of that term is wrong, then please excuse me. Our high schools refer to their sport teams as girls and boys teams…but maybe we are all wrong.
I am sorry that I do not have time to reply to all the posts in this thread, as I am very busy. But will take some time to respond to this one and hopefully answer a few questions for all.
The point of my original post was to discuss how women nowadays are predisposed to recreating ‘the natural into the unnatural’ matisse.
I make no demands women change in any way. My only demand is that I may have freedom to live, think and to write. but this is something you wish to deny me it seems.
You write; “This doesn’t seem to be the proper forum to air your personal sexual fantasies.”
I tried to keep such personal sexual discussion to a minimum and focus on the subject of natural girls and the defacement to their bodies. Don’t forget, the girls of today will be the women of tomorrow. We are at a ‘simple living’ and ‘enough’ forum, so I felt it a timely topic to bring up.
You write: “Oh Man…Jesus Christ… you sound like you have some serious issues.” …Because I wish for a person to be at peace with their natural state of being?
You write I “sound like a pedophile” …Do I sound like a pedophile matisse because I appreciate natural beauty? I appreciate it in old as well as young. I find many women into their 60’s and some beyond beautiful.
You write “Let me guess, you (V) prefer women to be “brazilian waxed”. The less a woman appears to be an adult, the better for you, correct?” …re-read my OP. I wrote about natural girls, although I am not adverse to a hair cut if hair is excessive. I like women to look like women. These issues you mention stem from your own personal prejudices. All problems are created in the mind. These are just such issues that bother you but do not bother me and you have to come to peace with them for yourself. I make no demands that anyone change…I only comment on their actions.
You write: “One would think sex addicts have plenty to work on within themselves before complaining about others.” … Successful transformation in recovery requires one to look within as well as to look outside of one’s self. I learn form all…both as to success and failures. When I see a direction that leads to failure - I do the opposite.
You write: “Men who need porn to stimulate themselves sexually have deeper problems then how women should appear.” … well the women must appear in the porn first to stimulate the man. Men are visual creatures when it comes to sex…so what. This is how nature created men. Should the nature of man be all changed around to accord with the will of matisse? About 95% of the men masturbate at some time in their life. Women masturbate as well, so do animals, it is natures way. The only questions is if they masturbate in excess and it ends up destroying one’s peace.
Being hyped up is a byproduct of sex. One goes with the other, so no use beating yourself up over it. The nature of the beast with sex is to get excited, so this is what makes it tougher addiction than food and spending, as we can eat or spend and still be devoid of most of the excitement from these areas if we wish. But in general, we cannot participate in sexual activity without getting excited. In addition, it takes a day or two for some of us to go back to normal from sex, so this refractory period is another area to deal with whenever we get hyped up sexually. Is this refractory period bad? No, it is just how things are. The problem with addicts is they overdo things to a point of pain or even under penalty of death. (If you missed my earlier post "7 benefits addictions provide us and wish a copy write me direct.)
vpul.upenn.edu/ohe/library/S … bating.htm
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Animal_sexuality
You write: “The “right” direction meaning the direction of your choice.” …No, not my choice matisse…it is nature’s choice and the choice of finding inner peace by being at peace with who you are. If nature is not right in the broader sense…then who is? Sure, humans fight nature with their ego, but in the end nature always wins matisse.
You write: “You remind me of the dark side of self-esteem.” …you are entitled to your opinions.
But what else can you say matisse?
Of course you must use ‘ad hominem’ attacks on me.
I damaged you sense of self…your ego got bruised.
When we invest excessive time and energies in acquiring or building attachments to self, these attachments become veritable extensions of our being and come to define us for ourselves as well as define who we are for others. When these attachments take on this role we become susceptible to pain via these extensions.
If the person, place or thing we are attached to gets rebuked it is a personal rebuke on us, if they get damaged or defaced so goes the defacement and damage to our very being. The ancient Greek philosophers knew that when passion rules the mind, that the only job left for reason is that of the subservient task to find cleaver ways to satisfy the passions. They called it “putting passion before reason.”
The three unwholesome roots of delusions, greed and hate are very basic to a a Buddhist practice matisse. Out of these three, delusion is the foundational root, for without seeing delusions for what they are, you cannot distinguish the other two unwholesome roots of greed and hate.
This ‘delusion of self’ can be seen in all the hate mail I get by women from this post. Some women will see only what their ‘self’ wants them to see and nothing more. Other women are more clear thinking in nature and can see truth without obscuring it with their own prejudices.
Delusional persons concentrate on personalties, whereas persons not of this deluded nature concentrate on truths. In your post you conveniently have skirted over the discussion I brought up and spent your time tearing me down instead.
Women, generally do not like hearing about this subject from men. Most women have a chip on their shoulder…or should I say a chip on their breast concerning men.
Women have a hubby on one breast, a kid on the other breast and the rest of the male population trying to get a piece / peace of them as well.
So, who can blame women for carrying a grudge and being overly sensitive in this area after everyone is trying to grab at them
If one can go beyond self and all the attachments and prejudices, likes and dislikes contained within that self, then one will have an easier time getting at the true nature of things.
One time at eSangha (where I was banned) there was a discussion about the possibility of a woman finding enlightenment. A lady recounted how she asked her Buddhist teacher if a woman can ever reach enlightenment. The teacher told her no. As she was perplexed, she continued questioning the teacher until he told her that a woman cannot reach enlightenment until she transcends the concept of being woman.
If we look at the average woman what does she do in the morning?
She spends an hour putting on a mask to be something that she is not.
The rest of the day is spent looking in the mirror…and hating what she sees.
Can such a person reach enlightenment? (No)
Is makeup up all that is holding her back from enlightenment? (NO)
If makeup was the only issue, men would have it made.
But we each carry our own self with us and define our lives with who we ‘think’ we are via this conception of self.
Most women define self though beauty. And for men, they define life and self for the most part trough their penis.
For enlightenment and inner peace one must seek self without self.
But as they say, beauty is in the eye of the beholder. If women like to disfigure their bodies in search of beauty to be something they are not…that is their right.
I only ask matisse that I may enjoy and appreciate this same freedom or right at looking for naturalness in all things…including women.
You write: “Males project their idealized image of how women should look then, when they are accommodated, turn around and attack that very same image.” …I never said that at all. When did I say I like women to have their nipples and genitals pierced with metal, have their tongues and faced covered with rings and studs. Deformed breasts and lips with silicone, inked up bodies, deformed feet with unnatural shoes?..this is all up to the women to decide as choices for themselves. To me it is ugly, not beauty … don’t put words in my mouth, take responsibility for your own actions matisse.
A lot of the women I see seem to be like animals caught in trap, squirming and writhing in every direction, looking, grasping outside of themselves for freedom from this trap to find a modicum of inner peace.
But the trap is an ‘inner one’ and all their efforts grasping outside of themselves are futile.
Always remember, passions are rooted in the self and the self is always is in flux which accounts for the rise and fall of these passions.
Whereas, truth is stable - for the truth is that which does not change.
The truth is: we are all born natural and what we do to this nature is how we recreate ourselves matisse.
Also see my earlier discussion of this ‘nature’ topic:
jesusneverexisted.org/jne/forum/ … opic=342.0