What Trump Voters Got Right

Philosophy Forums Society, Government, and Economics
21

ok, let us begin a little economic history lesson…

name the 5 times massive tax cuts occurred in our history?

the first one was in 1920’s… you might say that kicked off
the roaring 20ties but that isn’t the truth…

in 1918, the top rate of taxes was increased to 77% of income over
one million dollars… to finance the first world war…
but as the years passed the top marginal tax rate was
reduced to 58% by 1922, to 25% by 1925 and to 24% in 1929…
but look at history… the great depression occurred in 1929…

and during the twenties, very large segments of the population suffered
greatly, especially those involved in agriculture… farming and dairy especially…

millions of farmers were driven off their land during the 1920’s and the price of
things like milk dropped so low in price as to cause farmers to get them to dump
milk into the ground…it wasn’t worth their effort to grow things if it cost them money
to grow or to milk cows… so the 20ties were already a time of great problems in
industries as in agriculture…

and note the tax cuts lead up to the Great depression…after every great tax cut
came a recession… notice that as we go along…

the next great tax cut came in 1964… as with any tax cut, it takes roughly
two years before its effects are felt in the economy…now one might claim
that it was the tax cuts that drove the expansion of the economy in the 1960’s…
but that isn’t true… think about it? what else happened starting in 1964?
the broad expansion of the war in Vietnam… it was the classic Keynesian
economic of war that drove the outbreak of economic growth… not the tax cuts…

the next thing to notice is the economic weakness of America during the 1970’s…
there was a recession from 1973-1975… less then 10 years after the tax cuts, came
deep economic problems… and another recessions from 1979- to 1982…both came
as a result of tax cuts from 1964…note that years after the tax cuts came deep
economic problems…is a theme we shall see again…

now the next big tax cut comes in 1981, cut the highest tax rate from
70% to 50% and the lowest tax rate from 14% to 11%…

so guess what happens a few years later… another economic weakening…
starting in 1989 lasting through 1990…after another tax cut in 1986…

so we see a pattern…after every single tax cuts comes a recession…

in 1993 came the Clinton tax increase and what happened?

the best economy in 40 years… Clinton final 4 budgets were balanced
and came with a surpluses…beginning in 1997 the debt held by the public
was pared down over 1998-2001… the only time this happened between 1970
and 2018…the single best economy over a 50 year period…

and we have bush Jr… who cut taxes in 2001 and 2003…
and then what happened? why a economic meltdown… the 2008 depression
the worst since the Great depression…every single time a tax cut
occurred, a depression occurred, every single time…

so, we have the IQ45 tax cuts… the single largest revision of the tax codes
in 40 years…
we will never know what the effect of those could be because of the Trump depression
of 2020…but I am willing to bet those tax cuts will do what every single tax cuts has
done… create an economic recession

but that doesn’t matter because the current economic collapse…and tax cuts won’t
solve a dam thing… they make matter worse… always…

there is not one piece of evidence that tax cuts help the economy
and plenty of evidence that tax cuts in fact damage the economy…

so if tax cuts won’t work, then perhaps the Clinton solution might work…

use taxes to readjust the economy… but instead of going from the lower and middle
classes to the highest classes, we reverse this and take taxes from the rich
and put them to the lower classes and middle class…

but this is one possible solution to our current crisis…
we have other solutions…and that is next…

Kropotkin

22

And be sure to note that absolutely nothing else was going in the US during that entire time other than taxes going up and down and recessions and depressions. Obviously only tax rates caused the only other things going on - depressions.

23

K: do you want me to go through the entire economic history of America over
the last 100 years? buy a book…I pointed out tax cuts… of course there are
other factors which I am happy to acknowledge but I am talking about tax cuts,
and not the economic history of America over the last 100 years…

Kropotkin

24

No. I don’t want you to discover any truth or stop misleading or lying. I wouldn’t be able to identify you so easily.

25

a divisive false dichotomy, brilliant, they exist.

Consumerism, might it be separated from capitalism, without it’s vector being mistaken for communism? Not either A or B?

Supply and demand are subject to manipulation in direction. I do not gather they are merely two sides to the swing of a pendulum.

It is also interesting there is this notion of a culprit. This culprit, suspected of the crimes of dishonesty and divisiveness in reporting. How widely are you willing to believe this is taking place? What proof did you require to accept it as reality?

Are some telling the truth and some lying or is everyone lying? Cause there seems little left we see as commonly true. All media hype aside. I have no first hand experience of an election that was corrupt. I submitted the forms to request my ballot, the jurisdiction responsible acknowledged the request and it was being processed. The jurisdiction responsible sent me a physical piece of mail confirming the process. My ballot was received when they said it would be, and the jurisdiction involved confirmed it as a record. I filled in my ballot, had it witnessed and dropped in a locked depository. The jurisdiction involved processed it as being received into record and was awaiting vetting. Two days later they recorded the ballot was vetted, it’s reception and progress through the system was a matter of record, two days after the votes had been certified there was a record that my ballot had been counted, three times.

My first hand experience was there was no voter fraud. I am confident my vote counted.

Fact check, given few of us have access to the events in play first person, and all of us are at the whim of who ever is doing the reporting. So there is a fairly narrow outlet of information you will trust. My outlets have narrowed so much there is no one who’s reporting I can trust. That pretty much runs the gamut right up and down the consumer/capitalism dishonesty and divisiveness I’m seeing. Claim, capitalism as an economic system creates products that are durable, consumerism does not. Capitalism would seek out ways to make less resources perform more, consumerism would not.

So Trump wants to have my ballot thrown out because our state has prohibited the counting of mail in ballots prior to elections day out of abundant caution against fraud, and he thinks because he was ahead at the start that’s going to make him a winner in the end. The tortoise and the hare. Slow and steady wins the race.

Let’s play the fact check game and see who is dependent on a corrupt media to corroborate their personal first had account of Trump.

26

December 14th comes along and we will see what happens. We shall see how our representative electorates will cast their votes. All of it, up until then, is foreplay, and I am aware how arousing someones breath in ones ear can be.

If that is blowing smoke up someones ass then there is some degree of truth in a violation of intention.

Who’s breath in your ear intoxicates? Has some form, any form of media done that? Does advertising do that all the time? Capitalism has become consumerism’s bitch. When one human can’t trust another, ya might as well just get out your guns. Might makes right.

Poll, does this hurt any one else’s head but mine…That a lie in play is just one vote away. If that’s what this democracy is all about…what are my other options? Cause this ride is no fun, constitutionally. God or not. But man, there is one thing I’ve learned is the Constitution party ain’t got anything to do with the Constitution, as it is based primarily is religious dogma.

Can’t we just get the shit like god that can’t be proven out of the political and economic picture? No, I don’t trust in god. Yet every piece of money we bargain with has that stamped upon it. What sort of fucked up shit is that? If I will do business with you I want to trust you not some bitch slut of a god.

27

Hello Mowk, thanks for the reply. This is my understanding of supply side vs. demand side economics as well. It is more about guiding from which side the push and pull come from. In supply-side economics, or more specifically trickle-down Reaganomics, there is the idea that by restricting & removing regulations, businesses will not be hampered by the red tape of bureaucracy. By lowering taxes on corporations, businesses, and the ultra wealthy, these businesses will be more free to expand operations, creating more job growth, more opportunity, etc. The ultra-wealthy will spend this money back into the economy, a direct stimulus. As a result, the recipients of these jobs created where none would have existed before are better off (vs. unemployment). This is the idea of trickle down economics. Now, from my perspective, it seems like there are a LOT of people, many of them Trump supporters, who are still waiting for this “trickle.” The trickle has slowed to a periodic drip. As faulty as anecdotal experience is, my personal observation over the decades has been that there are fewer ladders for economic mobility than before. That, I believe, is a bigger problem than most people imagine, because the disappearance of that economic mobility, in my experience, has slowly worn away whatever feeling of “manifest destiny” I may have felt before. After all, what’s the point of barely scraping by on two jobs, when you can collect unemployment instead? And would it not be much more motivating to go to work at Taco Bell every day, if that job could afford you a modest living, i.e. shelter/clothing/food and independent living?

In regards to the media, I’ve noticed a lot of projection on that front. I personally look at all of the media I can, simply to be able to understand where narratives are originating. I look at Breitbart, Realclearpolitics, OANN, etc. I check out CNN and FOX news to see each of their biases and rhetoric in action. When I want to check out news with as little rhetoric and opinion as possible, I go to APnews and Reuters. The truth is, those who criticize media have a point, and in some ways, MSM shit their own bed. In other ways, it seems to have been an unconscious and unguided result of the internet age, when news outlets had to come up with new ways to make up that ad revenue. Lo-and-behold, opinionated narratives filled that gap quite nicely. We are now experiencing the long term effects of that shift, and I’m short on ideas of how to even begin addressing the problem (some independent regulatory agency that is responsible for fact checking? How would we keep it uncompromised from political influence? How could that not be considered “state media?”). I agree with the idea that a well informed citizenry is essential to a functioning democracy (or democratic republic), so it is something that needs to be addressed sooner rather than later.

28

And when the US electorate becomes only you what you have said becomes relevant. The fact that one voter got counted properly is irrelevant to how many didn’t.

Another false dichotomy. Consumerism can be abused, as can capitalism but they are not counter opposed nor allegiant. When consumerism is promoted to an abusive level (which has occurred frequently) both capitalist and corporate socialist agenda are satisfied because neither of those respects or regards the healthy and happy life of the consumers.

No he only wants all uncertifiable ballots thrown out. By your recount yours would not be one of those. But for every fraudulent ballot a certifiable ballot is cancelled.

It is actually the reverse of your media reports. It is BIDEN who is trying to cancel votes through fraud (He even said so himself on video).

If you could do that, which you can’t, you would find that Mr Hidin, Lyin Biden is the disingenuous fraud. The whole reason the propaganda industry exists is because you have no means to verify what you are hearing unless you spend a great deal of time very carefully examining bits of potential evidence. And people just do not take that time and interest. That is why it is used - “I heard that Trump is a bad bloke. I think I’ll vote for that other bloke. What’s his name again?”