Where is Meaning?

[sage_leaf]

@Cafe Rob

NZ is a materialistic society!

LOL - yes… although I am interested in how NZ compares to other Western societies. NZ historically has a very strong social welfare system (‘Cradle to the Grave’) while later policies have been put into place to provide more ‘balance’ between individual and state responsibilities. I do often see what seems to me like pronouced inequalities in NZ. But then when I talk to other people from other Western countries, I’m often left feeling that relatively speaking, there a a lot more such extreme outcomes that are commonplace in other countries. I’d be interested in what you think.

@Cafe Rob

@sage_leaf

Obviously, we are usually influenced by a huge number of factors when we make these choices (social-cultural-personal experiences-situations-frameworks-dominant ideologies etc)

Yes, I agree we are, that is depending on one’s knowledge and education,but I would say that in the main choices are made on the basis of money and sex and that personal integrity is compromised because of this.

(side note: I have noted that The Most highly intelligent (profoundly gifted) people I’ve known, frequently fail to place as high an emphasis on things such as money/possessions, even sex - not saying they don’t have some measure of importance- as many other people do (including some very intelligent people). Maybe, intellectual ability- or wisdom- could be added alongside knowledge and education. Ability to, or ways of processing the knowledge and education is bound to effect the outcome.)

So perhaps we could reframe these as a type of ‘power’ (ie ability to obtain, money, sex, or other things our little hearts desire - which might also be said to be things that we may see as giving our lives meaning?)

so what do you think about these thoughts…?

There are many types of power, with many potential limitations to the level of power that any particular individual can access or achieve.

If power is the ability to do or obtain something, then…
(using this definition, therefore, the desire for power, includes the desire for life, the desire to do things to benefit or harm, oneself or others)

People generally make choices with a view to increasing their power.
The desire for power is a strong motivation. By this (wide) definition of power, it could even be argued that it is the only motivation for action.

Some individuals value the desire for personal power more highly than their desire to retain a sense of personal integrity.***

People often seek power based on the ‘meanings’ they choose to adopt as having value. An individuals assessment of the relative importance of the ‘meanings’ in their life is likely to be reflected in the types of power they seek.**

Although (for the sake of thinking)…
*** There are some very different ideas of what ‘integrity’ means. A person could potentially see achieving the highest level of power that they could as being the thing that they could achieve that would have the highest level of integrity - in which case there would be an inheritant equality.

** Naturally, this could be limited by other factors such as a sense of being ‘undeserving’ or a lack of self-confidence, etc. Although (again!) ‘limiting factors’ could also possibly be interpreted as being Meanings in their own right. (I’m sure that there is better way of saying this - but this is all I can come up with at present)

Understanding what is meaningful to an individual is the most useful tool in predicting their most likely course of action.

but I guess that’s well known?..

[Cafe_Rob]

@sage_leaf

LOL - yes… although I am interested in how NZ compares to other Western societies. NZ historically has a very strong social welfare system (‘Cradle to the Grave’) while later policies have been put into place to provide more ‘balance’ between individual and state responsibilities. I do often see what seems to me like pronouced inequalities in NZ.

Well yes, I was thinking about suburbs like Otara and Naenae and rural towns like Harewa and Kaikohe and the growing number of beggars around Auckland inner city at night. Surely the spawning ground for crime. Given NZ’s size I would say it has its comparable share of less fortunate people.

But my point is this if we say life has no meaning outside of one’s personal meaning and there is no objective moral standard, then surely all we are left with is Nietzsche’s theory of “Will to Power.”
If organised religion and it’s associated relief organisations like the Anglican ‘City Mission,’ disappear what takes their place?

Two books; ‘Les Misérables,’ by Victor Hugo and ‘No Beast So Fierce’ by Edward Bunker. One attests to human compassion and the other to the lack of success of government run agencies.

As Schopenhauer says in the in the opening page of his book “On the Basis of Morality,” To preach morality is easy, to found it difficult.