Why should you not take advantage of the weak and be bad ?

Why should you not take advantage of the weak and be bad instead of good?

how do you define bad and good? but really.

do you play poker? taking advantage of someone else by attempting to decieve them is the sole objective of poker. Taking advantage of someones grandmother is no sign greatness, so the question is , why settle to take advantage of the weak when we can strive to take advantage of the strong and thus show tru greatness? its a matter of knowing your limitations.

Some people set different limitations for themselves, and it is this(our self defined limitations) which encompose our range of possible actions. That said, some people , when they reach thier limitations will push further and try to expand upon these limitations. The people who take the chance and try to go beyond they’re limitations are the truely brave and thus are deserving of all the success and failure which come as a result.

Some people, usually the “well off”, have no need of taking advantage of others because they are already happy with who they are.

I think that the effects of your actions don’t die. If you give shit to someone else, they’re just going to give it to the next person (out of revenge or resentment?)…and they give it to the next person…and on and on.

Pretty soon, the whole world is a fucked up place (by that, I mean that there is very little [human] pleasure)…and you are stuck living in that world, and you can no longer maximize your pleasure. The pleasure you get from making the world a “better” place (should) outweigh the pleasure that you get from treating someone else like shit.

Then again, am I wrong in saying that everything is just for power and release of one’s strength anyway? You inevitably act for your own self-benefit and try to impose yourself and your values on other people. I think manipulation and control over others becomes somewhat of an inevitability…

This whole area interests me hugely being a lefty and a fan of Nietzsche and Stirner. First of I don’t believe in absolute good or evil and I’d agree with what October says in general especially

This has to be your primary motivation - after that’s though do we have to accept that acting with and beyond your limits - exercising your power and grabbing what pleasure you can must necessarily, always involve the doing down or subtracting from others?
And if everyone realized and acted from their strengths (Hobbes war of all against all I suppose!) - would that be a bad thing or might we just rough out something better then the present society with it’s massive, built in power unbalance where a few just take almost everything?

Krossie

Exploiting & consuming the “weak” is not as logical as assimilating them so that the collective gains more power.

What is everyone decides not to be weak and, voluntarily and conciously organise collectively to muliply their strengths

  • or is it all relative
    i.e. if everyone is strong it’s no longer strength??
    or are some people incapable of strength?
    or are there diffrent types of strength exerted in different manners?

Krossie

krossie -

Bingo!

This is the point most often overlooked by readers of Nietzsche, by most philosophers and by people in general. The Great Big Question is wrongheaded - your question here points us to a lot of little questions.

Well done. A question like yours allows, all by its little self, a better analysis of Nietzsche, but more importantly, a better analysis of the issue itself.

It’s just so darned unphilosophical. Just not as much filosophical fun.

Oh well.

People only feel mighty when surrounded by weakness.
You only feel ritch when you are around allot of poor people.

Human instinct drives humans towards inequality.

Cheers faust I’m flattered!

Also strength can be exerted very subtly and in a very weak seeming way - also over long intervals of time. (everything subtle loves the mask etc etc)
Sorry about the sexism…but
…maybe this is what Nietzsche was getting at with “If truth is a woman what then?”

As life goes I think men and women will have to apply strength in different ways and over different time scales - can be just as satisfying (as when a long term plan comes together) and weakness can be used as strength (whinging and whining your enemy down - kids discover it early!)

On the other hand you don’t get to make cool statements like Dan’s

~[krossie]~

Yes, Krossie, that’s the problem. As to Nietzsche’s analysis (as an example of the kind you are making) people often see him as attacking on some bold front - destroying all in his path - but it’s not with a bulldozer, but with a pick and shovel. He is not destroying all in his path, but clearing a path one stone at a time.

This subtle strength - like religion. The slave mentality, as N puts it, has a strength of its own. The slaves can become the masters. Just as an example. In fact, seperating the examples from the general statements is a big difficulty for many in reading N.

And yes! Long periods of time - events occur in time - things are processes - it’s not just a black and white photograph, it’s a technicolor feature film.

Another key to Nietzsche and to philosophy is to pick your teachers well - children are often among the very best. You have said a lot in your little post.

Kids are great - in small doses! - x - girl friends too
under the same strict conditions

Yeah I do vaguely remember “the slave revolt in morals” as being a collective excretion of “strength” by “the weak” and utilising the even better disguised real strength of “the priests” (which they exerted by elevating “weakness” (meekness) to a position of strength aka judeo/christian religion under their expert guidance (of course) - roughly!)

Krossie

No one is answering my questions.

PG - that’s ILP for you. No one behaves weel, here. I guess we’re being bad. But, why not?

thats what im asking!

And there are answers and there are answers. Your “dumb blonde” act doesn’t always dictate the action.

there’s always a bigger fish

if you set the doors open for everyone to take advantage of others you’ll get screwed yourself as well

Dunno Dan I actually feel stupid and wrong when surrounded by weakness and/or poverty- I don’t think it enhances my “power” in any way – I’m not sure people always respond to external stimuli in that way or need it even– maybe most do – I can’t speak for them!

Dunno philosophy girl I think we’re getting some interesting ideas around strength/weakness – maybe not on bad/good – I never knew a short question in philosophy that had a short answer
– Jay sus – don’t make that into a thread!

Krossie

Why should you take advantage of the weak and be good instead of bad?

:^o I rest my case.

Can’t you see how true what I said was?

People measure by comparison.
If they compare themselves to lessers, they feel larger.
And comparison is first awareness, then focus.

But you were talking about yourself, not the majority.
The majority will “go with the flow”;
They will be completely controlled by their environment.

[b]that everything is just for power and release of one’s strength anyway?

This has to be your primary motivation - after that’s though do we have to accept that acting with and beyond your limits - exercising your power and grabbing what pleasure you can must necessarily, always involve the doing down or subtracting from others?
And if everyone realized and acted from their strengths (Hobbes war of all against all I suppose!) - would that be a bad thing or might we just rough out something better then the present society with it’s massive, built in power unbalance where a few just take almost everything? [/b]

as regards your 1st question, simply no. Your aspirations are your own and whether they spring from a casual feeling of adventurousness or clear and conscise plan based upon time tested principles, any aspirations you have are products of your own beliefs and assumptions. When you have a desire to do anything there are reasons , and whether you aspire to help, hurt, or not effect others is a matter of personal choice and means. I don’t accidentally murder someone(goes against the definition of murder, accidental is manslaughter) or pledge money for a cause, its a conscious choice i make at a specific time when an oppertunity for action arises. This being said, the variety of actions which can be undertaken are limited by our location, time, and our means. aka different actions have different prerequisites. You have to understand the end goal as well as the means required to attain that end goal to effectively do anything. That being said, we have the capacity to act in ways which are both helpfull and hurtfull or positively or negatively effecting our surroundings.

as regards your 2nd question, i would say that we can only realize our strength after acting and thus the prospect of realizing our strengths is a grand one. I would say that given the broad range of possible strengths and weaknesses someone may potentially have that its something of a craps shoot. We are more or less mainly limited in our range of actions by our means. After we aquire the means(prerequisites) to initiate any action and try to implement it, only then do we fully begin to realize our personal limitations. I say “personal limitations” because the means(prerequisites) for any action are more or less universal. So, given the broad range of possibilities we have for action(some having a more broad range than others) having the means to test all of these possibilities and thus fully realize our "strengths " is nothing more than a pipe dream.
If we can find something of intrest that is within our means and that we can excell at, we are among the lucky few. But, thats not to say we can’t all expand upon our abilities and find something were “good” at.

also, i define for myself what is “good” and what is “bad” usually with some guidance from my parents.