Will machines completely replace all human beings?

The motor portion of what they were showing was most definitely below 10,000 nanometers. Your arguments as to why it “should not” be called an “electric motor” is pedantic, irrelevant, and a bit … ummm … “youthful”.

What you are doing is exactly how religions get formed. Someone reveals a logical train of thought and out of a wish to believe (or even disbelieve) it all becomes a matter of supporting the pro or the con of the issue (the for or the against), egotism, religiosity.

You are obviously hoping that they do not succeed. I am not hoping one way or the other. I know that they will even though I still believe that it is a bad idea. I would wish that they don’t succeed, but I am not willing to lie in order to try to stop them (as with a great many other issues).

No, you are not talking physics, merely hope that Man cannot do what you disfavor.

James,

You confirmed what I was guessing.

You are thinking that I am trying to counter their claim because either I do not see it in the virtue or it clashes with my religious beliefs, but neither is true.

As far as any invention or knowledge is concerned, it always remains in the state of a third person. Means, it is neither good or bad in itself but depends on its use.

Atomic energy can light millions of houses but kill those Millon’s too in the same breath. A killer can take a life with a knife bit the same knife can save a life too in the hands of a surgeon. The same is with this nano thing too. It can be very useful or very dangerous too but that is not the issue of here.

The only issue pertinent here is the pheasibility of true manmade and controlled nano machine. That is all.

Secondly, whether it is pheasible or not, does not have any bearing on my beliefs/ideology either. What I want may be different from the ground reality in this case, which happens many times, though I do not have much issue with this nano thingy. I am not sure how you concluded that.I do not see any extraordinary bad implications of this nano exploration.

The biggest concern for me is our education system; how we handle our teachers and children, which again do not have any relation with my religious beliefs.

James, I am looking at this nano motor purely from scientific/philosophical perspective, not ethical. I do not not see its happening just because that scale itself forbids that.

I am not sure whether you understood my perspective or not. Let me try it rephrase it.

There are some compounds of silver which reacts with the light. If we put them in the sunlight, the reactions would start happening. In other words, the energy of photons will be used for chemical reactions. Right.

And, we know that this event will be played out at nano level or even beyond that. There is no other way of happening that either. Now, we put all this into vacuum and absolute zero temperature under the controlled light and use ETM and see it happening at nano level. But, would it be justified to claim that we have created and controlled things at nano level?

That is precisely my objection. The precision is more in
observation or measurement, not in the making per se.

With love,
Sanjay

Arminus - Is it possible that you are occupied by your idea?

Sanjay - Quite possible. That happens to everyone. The trick is being able to entertain other or even opposite ideas at the same time. That is what objectivity is.

Arminus - By whom or what are they made? By God(s)? By nature?

Sanjay - By nature/existence itself.

Arminus -By nature? Do you have evidence?

Sanjay - What else evidence is required when we see it happening all around automatically!

Arminus - Show us your evidence, Zinnat

Sanjay - Arminus, I was talking about definitions, and they do not have evidences. Definitions are proposed benchmarks for any thing, real or imaginary.

I think that perhaps you are asking for the explanations for different definitions of nano. Though, I have provided in the last post but let me put those again in simpler way.

There are two different scales; micro and nano. Micro means 10-6 while nano means 10-9, if we go by the original propagators of the concepts. But, over the time, the term nano is used more like a metaphor for all small things, instead of its true definition.

We have only breached micro level successfully do far, not nano level. The attempts are on to make and control nano level things. Yes, we can now measure events at nano level under some artificially enforced extreme circumstances. That is our actual present status.

But, what happens sometimes in popular media and even in scientific circles too, that things are either misrepresented or blown out of the proportion. Such futuristic claims are made which are impossible. And, it is not my opinion only but many others also share it, including experts of that field, as I quoted in my previous posts too.

The term nanotechnology is more a metaphor than a reality. Almost all below 1 mm things are being called as nano and that process is nanotechnology, whether they are of the scale of 10-9 or not.

For instance, nonstick taflon coating on the utensils is now claimed to be done by nanotechnology. Tennis rackets are being claimed to be made by nanotechnology. But, strictly speaking, all these claims are false.

When we are unable to make and control even a single nano thing in normal circumstances so far, how these things can be claimed as being made by using nanotechnology!

But, the problem is that most of the people do not understand this. They get the false impression of the reality.

Arminus -But why do you not tell us your definition of “observation”? If you do not do it, then we have and are going to go on with our definition.

Sanjay - I have been given already. Perhaps you did not notice. Here it is again -

Here in this thread, observation is slightly different or one step ahead from what we understand in science. Scientific observation means gathering the information and process it. But, here observation includes cognitive effects too.

Like, a robot can observe and analyze the loss if one of its leg would break but that incident would not manifest any feeling in it. On the other hand, if the same would happen to anyone of us, we would observe the pain also besides our other physical damages.

With love,
Sanjay

It’s already happened in anime therefore it can happen in reality.

Is that an argument?

With love,
Sanjay

Please explain what you concretely mean.

Probably we have to wait until Zinnat will have learned that “trick”.

What is “it”?

So according to you the definitions are “happening all around automatically”, or what?

No.

There are more than two scales - for example 20 metric prefixes (SI prefixes). Excuse me, but I think you have no idea.

No. You are telling nonsense. “Nano” is well defined and used as unit prefix meaning one billionth.

Which things do you mean?

That is again nonsense. There are six prefixes which mean less than nano (billionth), namely: pico (trillionth), femto (quadrillionth), atto (quintillionth), zepto (sextillionth), yocto (septillionth). For example: a proton has a diameter of about 1.6 to 1.7 femtometres.

Most of the people do not understand many things anyway - that is unfortunately normal. So there is not another problem but the same old problem, Zinnat.

Yes, but that does not change anything of the definitions. The definitions of (for example) “observation”, “cognition”, “informnation”, “process” can remain as constant as before.

The film Ex Machina … selling horny little boys on building AIs til they die.

The film Chappie selling more love-thy-android and “hope to be uploaded into one” for the young South African masses. A remake of the 1986 film Short Circuit with “Number Five is alive” (selling to the little American boys and girls).

  • The film “Ex Machina” - little boys?
  • The film “Chappie” - little boys and girls?
    ???
    Is that weird or not?

Well, Ex Machina is for boys and young misandristic femi-larvae in the West.
Chappie is for simple rebellious authority hating youth in South Africa.

Both are design to instill endearment of the androids involved and a deep urge to fight for their cause of having equal to superior rights (much the same as the feminist movement). Hollywood is entirely psycho-engineering.

The goal of Hollywood is obvious.

What do you think about that?

DARPA is funding a great many such incentives for technological advancement through competition (causing it to be even less controlled).

Is DARPA really “independent from other military research and development and reports”?

That’s kind of a tricky question. DARPA (used to be ARPA) is funded by grants and is a think-tank organization (depicted on TV in the series Eureka). Congress disallows all of the research to be military defense so that the “Defense Budget” (around $800 bln) doesn’t include DARPA’s billions of dollars, a portion of which comes through corporate funding. They develop basically all of the super-high tech (unseen by the public) advances as well as the public’s much lesser advance “new technology”. Many projects are about exactly how to manipulate the public … into favoring more technology from DARPA. :evilfun:

DARPA is the science team behind the one-way mirror. Their advancement is expontial compared to the public because they see (and limit) everything the public develops plus invents their own secret projects that lead to much higher developments that the public is not allowed to know about. Then those developments lead to even higher developments which, over the years, lead to even higher developments so that the secret developments are always growing exponentially compared to what the public ever sees. All “UFO” concerns (for example) are merely DARPA projects at this point, probably 50-100 years ahead of what the public is allowed to develop.

RM:AO is actually for DARPA.

Example projects vary greatly:

Those just a few that the public are allowed to know about.

RM:AO is actually for DARPA?

How many times have I told you … it is really only for thinkers (at this stage). What you would call “the future” is actually already going on behind closed doors in the form of isolated communities and labs. A country can’t develop secretive highly advanced technologies without implementing them so as to see what develops next. In the long run, when it is deemed necessary, a small device or strategy is released to the public either for gaining more psychological effect, or perhaps to treat a newly developed social situation. In the mean time, the developing grows and grows and grows behind closed doors.

The future is predictable merely because it is being manufactured (quite a number of films on that issue as well). But that makes it harder to predict for those not making the manufacturing decisions.

Is or was ARPANET (the precursor of the INTERNET) the net of ARPA, later known as DARPA?

Sure. Who didn’t know that? :-s