Can you imagine to be dead?

Orbie

I would say that it had to be a great length of time to have come to that.
Like an animal caged up for so long that that’s all it knows.
Could there have been drugs given to these human beings?
I can’t imagine - started to viscerate themselves, eating their body parts, etc.
Aside from the so obvious abuse, they must have also been abused from the start in other ways, no?

But on another level, wouldn’t having to go back to the physical prison spell some kind of freedom to them, after the experience they had? Unless both “prisons” were equal.

Well, all I was saying was that I also love the dark, the darkness…the absence of light. But both give me an appreciation of both.
But darkness can be the freedom of the vampire - that’s his nature and his natural habitat. lol
It is the rising of the sun which becomes his death although vampires have evolved quite a bit lately. lol

I don’t agree with you insofar as the vampire not being able to enter into life - as an immortal, perhaps he can do it more abundantly because he realizes he has sooooooooooooo far to go until. But you can look at it another way. We’re all immortal in a sense until death comes to us - just as is the vampire - until his final death comes to him. Like everyone else, I suppose it depends on the individual how much the undead values life…just as it depends on he would does not have to live in darkness - how much he values life.

Arc,

As far as technical problems are concerned, I don’t wish to specify, but if i were to specify to You, the nature of these difficulties, well, let it to suffice to say, without effecting an exaggeration, that they are at times quite challenging.

One of the technical issues consists in not being able to paraphrase. As a consequence of this, I will have to post two items, one regarding the prisoner experiment case, and the other, delving into the other part of Your inquiry.

The Soviet prisoners’ incarceration were I believe mostly of the political transgression type, where any little alleged offense were politicized and aggrandize do to the effect of becoming violations against the state.

The test run by party affiliated doctors conformed to party line protocol, and there was no chance for these test subjects to avail themselves to the prerogative of these doctors to let some of them out, initially, when they still emitted cries and protestations.

There were no drugs administered before, during or after the experiment. The length of stay was not extremely long, maybe only a matter of weeks.

The thing that happened after a critical time elapsed, that they started to disconnect from awareness of their previous incarceration, so the lost connection with what that entailed.

The profundity of questions of why, have never been resolved. I will try to dig up this experiment, and again, I can not attach it for same said ‘technical difficulties’

This vampire metaphors of connecting his life habits of preference for darkness, was only meant to illustrate , and I apologise of forgetting to include this in the original, philosophical narrative, of Plato’s Cave.

As such the metaphor could be drawn to cover the ancient absence of light, with the modern distrust of it.

Let me clarify, Arc. Light can be used again meta-phorically for a number of things, and here I would prefer to focus on light before The Enlightenment.
Science, as many benefits it has come to garner, is deistrusted by many, as having, or about to disconnect from it’s host, the natural environment.
Like a premature rush to get out from it’s parents, the child Science, wants a clean break away from those who gave it existence.

Your comment, that I am becoming robot like in my distrust of the technical aspects of communication, are a good example of this idea.

For instance, many educated people are getting the idea, that in the event of a world wide calamity, the under ground will again be sought out as the safest place, away from the infectious and poisonous quality of the above ground. In this sense, the darkness invites three real insecurity that the light can manifest, in such times.

Let me give You a personal anecdote that illustrates this concept. I am at variance with myself about the publishing of it, but here it goes.

After so many years, I still have flashbacks of it, due to the ingestion of a super sized amount of lysergic acid. This was decades ago, but the quantity was enormous. I ended up in a police department’s holding cell, and at one point, again. I died, which was recounted by some attendees.

I was taken back to the cell, after which I was in and out of consciousness, probably experiencing a life and death battle. There was a light just outside the locked door, and I remember asking the attendee, to turn it off. He said something strange, to the effect, that, most people on drugs want them on.

Looking back, this for me could have meant only one thing, in p(reference) to darkness, that if if dying, it would be more comfortable to do it in darkness.

Darkness could have symbolized that, from which going to death, would be less of a contrast. But I am sure there were other symbolic intros psychic communication going on.

Surviving the ordeal the development of extreme photo sensitivity may be an expected extension of that experience.

As always, Orbie

What will it be like to go to sleep and never wake up……

youtube.com/watch?v=Opn5iVaRyDU

Could have done it without the overload music. And what the hell is a political adept??

Being is being. You mean that there is no living being then. Okay. But there is being. Being is being. Thus being does not necessarily mean living being.

Are “YOU” a dead body? Or are “YOU” a living consciousness?

A living consciousness cannot be dead. Which one is “YOU”?

When “YOU” is not “YOU” any more, “YOU” are not “being”, but rather simply do not exist (although perhaps left behind the body that “YOU” used to inhabit).

If the soul physically leaves the body after death, perhaps the process of rebirth can be determined by the first person to walk into the corpse’s room.

I think Mr. Watts lives in a bubble, unaware of the concepts of pain, hell, investment, recurrence, or rebirth.

If we all had Mr. Alans attitude, I doubt there would be many great achievements…scientists, in the middle of building machines to better the quality of life, would say, “Doesn’t matter if I die, making scientific progress and improving the quality of life is not important. I’m okay with drinking mud water being chased by hyenas if and when I’m reborn into this world. The idea of making the world better before I left it doesn’t really matter, helping future generations doesnt really matter, death doesnt really matter, s’all good.” There would be no reason for philosophy and researching the afterlife, because hell and recurrence into bad worlds are thought of as neutral outcomes, that don’t really matter. Sort of like extreme frothing lunatic Nihilism.

Do you think that a consciousness can never be dead?

It can imagine dead, feel death.

You said that you “have been near death many times”.

Yep.

I have imagined what it’s like to be dead on several occassions, simply timeless consciousness staring at the sun, no needs no worries, only a pleasant pain.

However, my theory is that we are linked in the higher plane which is the sim realm, then above that the sou realm where we are all one.

The sim realm we have a higher genius ego that is all knowing, and are not limited to avatars but still there is a seperation, we are not our friends they are in seperate timelines. However, we do share the lives of several people in Earth realms, but not our friends they have seperate egos.

Higher than the sim realm is the soul realm where we are all one, however this takes a while for the recursision since there is a seperation of timelines between our friends and us, sometimes even millena goes past until we live each other’s lives. You have the option to not participate however there has become viruses in the programming causing Earth realms to degrade from original coding.

We, passengers, marvelled at the beauty of the coding enabling us to feel the illusion of free will and fell in love with our own ignorance, for the burden of knowledge left nothing to ego delusion, nor could we enjoy animal pursuits. However a virus in earth realms has prevented the fulfillment of coding.

I have absolutely no evidence of my theories and it is all blind faith based.

Some other philosophers say they know what happens when you die, but they appear to be dishonest and too rude to share their theories with the world.

You might want to define what YOU mean by consciousness here.

Doesn’t the word itself presuppose an awareness of some sort? having the capacity to experience, to think, to observe?
That requires a living organism. It also requires a “living” consciousness.

If you’re speaking of immortality, of a person who has died, if you believe in a soul, then perhaps it’s possible that one’s consciousness, IF housed ina soul, lives on somehow, somewhere.
Either way, Arminius, I don’t see how a “consciousness” can be dead - ever.
The very word consciousness stands for awareness.

Con - with
scious - knowledge

Of course, books have knowledge but we speaking of “living” “breathing” knowledge.

I can imagine what it’s like to temporarily be dead as I have been killed in dreams countless times in my life, starting from when I was a child.

When I actually die in my dreams (not wake up before I die, but actually die) the feeling is always the same. I get past the initial fear by ultimately accepting my fate, and I peacefully go deeper and deeper into a state of deep sleep/deep peace, and then I wake up.

I imagine the death of my body will be something similar, albeit more intense, more lucid, etc. because it will happen in both the material and subtle body, and not just the subtle body. That includes the waking up part, although I’d imagine that in what we call “actual” death, once I “wake up” I will have no recollection of what happened before, since I have no recollection of before birth.

And if someone asks “why put so much stock in what your dreams have informed you of?”, well, the answer is pretty simple if not infallible. I have experienced moments of deep romantic bliss in dreams when I kissed girls that I had deep crushes on. In fact, for many, many, many years the most euphoric moments of my life had happened in dreams when I had experienced that great, romantic, euphoric feeling of kissing a girl I had fallen in love with. 20 or so years later after the first time I experienced such a sensation in my dream, I finally kissed a girl I had fallen in love with and the sensation was identical, albeit amplified. Therefore, dreams have truly informed me of knowledge a priori.

Not that I am 100% certain, of course, that death will be relatively similar to how it has happened to me in dreams, but I’m pretty damn sure. The consistency of being killed/feeling fear, accepting the fate of death, and falling into a deep sleep/deep peace, and then waking up, has been entirely consistent many times throughout my life, with no deviation to speak of.

Yeah, a bright white light appears and you just get lifted, then transported to the inter-space, then temporarily held there. Death is just a process that takes place when the body dies…no big deal

I get where you are coming from and empathize with what you are trying to communicate, but I will have to challenge you on the notion that when people think of death, that they think of the body. It seems to me many people think of death as the end of everything, an eternity of “non-being” which to me is utter nonsense. One can imagine, like you said, the “I” no longer being part of the equation, even though it is still the “I” that is imagine it.

But when people ask “can you imagine being dead” I presume (wrongly?) they mean the “experience” of “nothingness” (again, I believe the “experience of nothingness” is bullshit, since nothing is not an experience, and therefore the whole concept of “nothing” to me, is utter nonsense).

One can only imagine decreased forms of life and call it “death”. Even when I describe what happens in my dreams when I “die”, as in, when I am dying and going into a deep sleep/deep peace, there is still an element of consciousness, some very depleted form of sense perception, and once it goes to near zero I wake up (out of necessity).

Question: Do you think/believe that after death there is “nothing” or do you, like me, find the concept of “nothing” to be nonsensical?

A sleep has an end. And the death? Is it endless? And if it is endless: How do you think or imagine an endless death?

One can’t imagine an endless death because it doesn’t exist/is utterly non-sensical.

Nature/existence is embedded in certain patterns. Such as day and night, winter and summer, death and birth, sleeping and waking, pleasure and pain, front and back, and on and on and on and on.

Everything that has a beginning has an end. So while death is the end of life, life is also the end of death.

While I obviously can’t prove to anyone, convince anyone, that this is the case, to me, this is about as factual as anything. Eternal non-existence is the single most incomprehensible concept I can think of, even more so than the Abrahamic God. To believe in something that the human mind can utterly not comprehend takes an enormous leap of faith, and thus I find it ironic that so many so called empiricists believe that when they die “they” will be dead “forever” as if there is still a “they” that “can” “be” “dead”. In other words, one cannot “be” dead. One is or one isn’t. And you and I ARE.

Wait …, “be” is not possible, but “is” and “are” are possible? You know that “is” and “are” are the inflected forms of the same Infinitive: “be”.