challenge to those who attack globalism

[Peter Kropotkin]

I have been called a traitor for supporting globalism...
I have stated multiple times why I believe globalism is
the future...

but those who oppose globalism haven't given a defense of
their position... they have attacked globalism without giving
a defense of their position.... in other words, their beliefs are
negative, not any positive beliefs....so this is your chance....

don't tell us globalism is bad, tell us why your positive beliefs are
correct.... state why you are correct without attacking globalism....


Kropotkin

[Otto_West]

I for one am happy that you have finally come out of the closet in pronouncing what we have all known for many years now. Took you long enough!

Just know that me and several others despise everything that you stand for.

Now, what are we proving and disproving in this thread again?

[WendyDarling]

Wendy wrote

Peter, communism (the KGB) was a police state and globalism is global communism. My defense, I enjoy being a USA citizen and am not willing to relinquish my freedoms that are guaranteed in its Constitution. I enjoy ownership: of things, cars, houses, property. I enjoy that in sovereign nations and capitalism there's no monopoly of corporate or government ownership which affords me choices to go live where I want, to work where I want, to buy what I want, to own what I want.

I'd go on but you cannot understand reality no matter how legitimate my standards are...nothing sane is proof enough for you. You do not live in reality only your make believe idealism and are a communist traitor to the USA government.

[WendyDarling]

Peter wishes to abolish our nation, the USA. He despises his citizenship enough to support it being torn apart to enable a communist regime to lord over everyone globally. Such USA citizens are disgraces to our forefathers who gave us a government with checks and balances and many freedoms, and to all those who fought in order for him to have the very citizenship he wishes to abandon. Servicemen and women laid down their lives for his ungrateful ass.

[Peter Kropotkin]

Peter wishes to abolish our nation, the USA. He despises his citizenship enough to support it being torn apart to enable a communist regime to lord over everyone globally. Such USA citizens are disgraces to our forefathers who gave us a government with checks and balances and many freedoms, and to all those who fought in order for him to have the very citizenship he wishes to abandon. Servicemen and women laid down their lives for his ungrateful ass.

K: not at all.... I just understand history.... see the difference between us is
simple, you fear the future and I don't.....you seem to think that the future will
hold terror of such magnitude that we must fear and escape the future....
I disagree.... will the future be an utopian paradise? NOPE, it will be somewhat
like today.... little good a little bad... What wendy doesn't see or understand is
that we are, right now, living in perhaps the best time in history....
and it came about naturally as we evolve as people....
recall that humans came from small families and small villages,
the problem was how to deal with a rising population.....
what is the solution? increase the institutions necessary to deal
with the rising population....in other words, larger government....
went from small and I do mean small villages to larger villages
and then onto towns and then larger and larger towns...
we have Athens which was a city/state and even larger
entities which we call nations.... at each step, the population
grew which entailed larger and larger institutions...
for each problem there is a solution and the solution
for a growing population is a ever growing government......

the size of government must be larger when you have
a million people as opposed to having 500 people.....
as Rome empire grew, so did its government.....

as we approach 8 billion people, the government, once again
must grow to accommodate the number of people.....
globalism is really a step to accommodate the number of people...
at each step were those who were afraid of the future and they
too accused those who looked to the future as being "traitors" and
an enemy of that country..... it the curse of pushing for a future...

as I mentioned, it won't be easy going into the future, there will
be moments like Nazi Germany and wars will be fought and
lives will be lost, but we must put aside our fear of the future
and work toward a future that will be brighter then the present is...
you too can accomplish this by simply working toward the future that
isn't a police state and that frightening place Wendy envisions.....

we make the future and we can make globalism as accepting
and understanding as we want... we don't need to be afraid
of the future like those like wendy and void and fixed cross....
their fear has driven them to fear the future to avoid
some imagined dystopian future whereas the future is most
likely to look more like today then some imagined police state.....

take away your fear and try to imagine some future that
is better then today and solves the problem of rising population....
and your answer will be globalism.....not some dystopian future....

Kropotkin

[surreptitious57]

dont tell us globalism is bad tell us why your positive beliefs are correct state why you are correct without attacking globalism

Nations are more manageable economically and socially and politically

They are the largest practical unit that can function independently

The existence of borders allows them a greater degree of security

They can maintain their own culture and customs far more easily

[Peter Kropotkin]

dont tell us globalism is bad tell us why your positive beliefs are correct state why you are correct without attacking globalism

Nations are more manageable economically and socially and politically

They are the largest practical unit that can function independently

The existence of borders allows them a greater degree of security

They can maintain their own culture and customs far more easily

K: ok, glad to see some attempt at a positive viewpoint.....

Now, with technology one can increase the manageability of a country...
if you follow history and technology ( a very, very interesting course could
come out of that one) you see with the rise of technology, the telephone for
example, you can increase the ability to manage a country...

as far as being the largest practical unit that can function independently,
as technology increases, we can increase that greatly...
think about it.... it really isn't any different from a technical standpoint,
whether the country has one million people or billions... it just takes
a little longer to process the information...

the most interesting point you brought up is the one about
is about culture and customs.... it has been the interchange between
cultures and customs that have created the greatest change....
one small example, my wife and I was in London last may, year ago,
and one of the dishes that was most heavily advertised was
chicken tikka masala, in fact it was considered the most "English"
of dishes.... as we all know, tikka masala is from India....
travel around a city, any city in the US and you will see
restaurant, many different types of restaurants, Indian,
Chinese, Japanese, Mexican, French, Italian.......
Thai...ummmmmmmm, anyway, which culture and customs are
we protecting when we go out to eat at these various restaurants?
you seem to think that cultural is some static thing, it isn't,
it changes and adapts and modifies all the time... there is no
such thing as native culture and custom especially in a country
like the U.S.... we are a country of immigrants and those
immigrants brought their own culture and customs to the U.S
and we have adapted and modified that culture and customs
into our own thing... like Chicken Tikka Masala being the
most important dish in England.......is that the native culture and
customs you are trying to protect?

Kropotkin

[Serendipper]

Why is globalism bad?

- Globalism produces a condition void of variety as its explicit goal (we are all one). Shall I continue on the ills of lack of variety?

- Globalism undermines freemarket competition and presumes an authority can dictate and properly account for all variables in the universe and proclaim a "right" decision.

You're correct that globalism is the way forward because the rise and fall of empires are cyclic and globalistic tendencies are the way down before the cycle starts anew from the antithetical position.

[URUZ]

PKommunist now openly reveals that he is a paid Shill. He must be feeling very overconfident indeed.

His hand has been forced-- by what? By that which he discounts most of all, and will never see unto the ends of his days-- truth.

[URUZ]

All these years and we thought of him as just another useful idiot. And indeed he is, yet his master is quite otherwise than he supposes.

Never mistake the metaphysical battle we are engaged in. Paid shills are merely pawns who fancy themselves kings, which delusion the powers that be are quite happy to continue entertaining... for a while.

Let the soulless fade into the nothingness from whence they came.

[WendyDarling]

Communists,
You do not live in reality only your make believe idealism. You do not live in reality only your make believe idealism. You do not live in reality only your make believe idealism. You do not live in reality only your make believe idealism.

You are unable to address any point realistically, taking history into account, analyzing current affairs rationally, and combining those two to see the most probable outcome. You really believe that your Democratic leaders have your best interests at heart and that is the sad part because there are many of yous out there, detached from reality, believing in some dystopian happily ever after like sheep to their slaughter.

You do not understand the checks and balances built into your very own government so that the government would have to take care of and protect its citizens. You don't understand that you live in the best country in the world. You don't deserve to be here in the USA.

Does any other government want a fucking traitor? We have millions of them in the USA that need to move out of the country they despise. Leave the USA Communists!

[Otto_West]

If I want to cook a foreign dish I'll cook it at home. Restaurants aren't needed. Internet has recipes all over the place. You will have to do better than that Peter.

Technology is an instrument of subjugation by the way and only gets worse as it advances.

You forget to mention things like A.I. or robotics.

[Ultimate Philosophy 1001]

Communists,
You do not live in reality only your make believe idealism. You do not live in reality only your make believe idealism. You do not live in reality only your make believe idealism. You do not live in reality only your make believe idealism.
Does any other government want a fucking traitor? We have millions of them in the USA that need to move out of the country they despise. Leave the USA Communists!

Seriously, are we still doing the anti-communism thing? Thought that died out in the 50's.

Capitalism, and anti-communism, were both political propaganda tools to enforce servitude to tyranny. For instance, banana republics in the south, used the "anti-communism craze" to get the US to assist with their dictatorship and tyranny. Capitalism is the main reason globalism exists, they want a one-world-government in order for the banks to rule the entire planet. It's all about money and capital.

[Otto_West]

Communists,
You do not live in reality only your make believe idealism. You do not live in reality only your make believe idealism. You do not live in reality only your make believe idealism. You do not live in reality only your make believe idealism.
Does any other government want a fucking traitor? We have millions of them in the USA that need to move out of the country they despise. Leave the USA Communists!

Seriously, are we still doing the anti-communism thing? Thought that died out in the 50's.

Capitalism, and anti-communism, were both political propaganda tools to enforce servitude to tyranny. For instance, banana republics in the south, used the "anti-communism craze" to get the US to assist with their dictatorship and tyranny. Capitalism is the main reason globalism exists, they want a one-world-government in order for the banks to rule the entire planet. It's all about money and capital.

Both capitalism and communism are flawed which I why I am a supporter of a third alternative whatever that may be. The United States is overrun with crony capitalists and communists where we need to purge both groups from existence.

[WendyDarling]

Communists,
You do not live in reality only your make believe idealism. You do not live in reality only your make believe idealism. You do not live in reality only your make believe idealism. You do not live in reality only your make believe idealism.
Does any other government want a fucking traitor? We have millions of them in the USA that need to move out of the country they despise. Leave the USA Communists!

Seriously, are we still doing the anti-communism thing? Thought that died out in the 50's.

Capitalism, and anti-communism, were both political propaganda tools to enforce servitude to tyranny. For instance, banana republics in the south, used the "anti-communism craze" to get the US to assist with their dictatorship and tyranny. Capitalism is the main reason globalism exists, they want a one-world-government in order for the banks to rule the entire planet. It's all about money and capital.

It's very much alive in China. However, communism under a corporate global government will happen rather than any capitalist spin, that's why I am vehement. Right now in the USA government, the corporations are only calling some of the shots, not all of them yet.

[Peter Kropotkin]

PKommunist now openly reveals that he is a paid Shill. He must be feeling very overconfident indeed.

His hand has been forced-- by what? By that which he discounts most of all, and will never see unto the ends of his days-- truth.

K: paid shill? then someone forgot to send me a check......and as I have mention but
because it doesn't fit your already preconceived notions you won't bring up, I am
in fact, not a communist....I know such distinction are little above your understanding,
but at least try to escape your preconceived idea's.......I have been very opened
about my idea's for years, I never hid them, there was no closet to escape from....
now my idea's have evolved, yes, but idea's should evolve and change and adapt
to ever newer situations.... I don't have the same idea's at 58 that I did at 38 or 28
or 18.....evolving idea's, changing to adapt to new situations, you may want to try that
entertain a new idea.. see how it fits... idea's are like clothes, it helps to change
them ever so often or otherwise they stink....


Kropotkin

[WendyDarling]

What are you Peter?

[URUZ]

Communists,
You do not live in reality only your make believe idealism. You do not live in reality only your make believe idealism. You do not live in reality only your make believe idealism. You do not live in reality only your make believe idealism.
Does any other government want a fucking traitor? We have millions of them in the USA that need to move out of the country they despise. Leave the USA Communists!

Seriously, are we still doing the anti-communism thing? Thought that died out in the 50's.

Capitalism, and anti-communism, were both political propaganda tools to enforce servitude to tyranny. For instance, banana republics in the south, used the "anti-communism craze" to get the US to assist with their dictatorship and tyranny. Capitalism is the main reason globalism exists, they want a one-world-government in order for the banks to rule the entire planet. It's all about money and capital.

It's very much alive in China. However, communism under a corporate global government will happen rather than any capitalist spin, that's why I am vehement. Right now in the USA government, the corporations are only calling some of the shots, not all of them yet.

Communism is pure evil anti-human, irrational, insane, murderous, soul-devouring, freedom-destroying, self-hating ideology of fantasizing against reality. Communism is literally a cultural-societal suicide button. I've done the theoretical work here outlining exactly why this is in philosophical terms, which I will not sully by posting at ILP. Wendy is free to request it via PM though.

Capitalism is the antithesis of communism. To equate the two is pathologically stupid, thus a sign of communistic thinking. The Red Scare was justified and that threat never went away, it has become much worse. We need a Red Scare awareness today that dwarfs what happened in the 50s-60s.

Only this time it has nothing to do with Russia. The USSR infected the west with Marxist communist poison and traitors like PKommie spread it. Now academia, entertainment, and politics are almost entirely dominated by capitalism hating, liberty hating, individual rights hating, rationality hating, America hating communist traitors.

The new Red Scare is awareness of the mortal danger of Marxism. Funny enough, Russia has overcome that danger far more than has the west. The current form of globalism is Marxist to the core, and trying to destroy Russia as well, so what does they tell you?

Positive values: reality, family, liberty, individual rights, self-defense, emotional stability, thoughtful, minimal government, free market localistic capitalism.

Negative values: fantasy, hatred of one's family, tyranny, loss of individual rights, no right or ability to self-defense, emotional instability, allergic to thinking, statist big government, neoliberal fake capitalism of crony corporatocratic monopoly authoritarian top-down command and control economy.

[WendyDarling]

Otto said he would support a new type of ideology not of socialism/communism or crony capitalism, but what? What people...think? Create...ideas are needed.

[URUZ]

We already have all the good and working ideologies we need. Individualism, rationalism, secularism, liberty and natural human rights, free market localist capitalism, and minimal government highly constrained by a Constitution into separation of powers and limited to the sole purpose of protecting the rights and freedoms of the people.

The government does not represent the people, the people represent the government, and the government's only legitimate purpose and function is to protect the rights and freedoms of the people who are representative of that social political system. I think the problem is that the Founders saw government as properly representing the people, but this puts the power and initiative in the hands of government even if only indirectly, thus no amount of safeguards in the Constitution can protect you from that government expanding forever in its necessary role and function of "representing you".

Rather, the government needs to be defined as that which the people represent: the most rational, philosophical, sane and reality-oriented compact of laws designed for the sole purpose of instantiating and protecting the rights and freedoms of the people. The people representing themselves, in other words, with government merely a symbol of that.

[Fixed Cross]

I have been called a traitor for supporting globalism...
I have stated multiple times why I believe globalism is
the future...

but those who oppose globalism haven't given a defense of
their position... they have attacked globalism without giving
a defense of their position.... in other words, their beliefs are
negative, not any positive beliefs....so this is your chance....

don't tell us globalism is bad, tell us why your positive beliefs are
correct.... state why you are correct without attacking globalism....


Kropotkin

Ehm....

no, Peter, you have not give your position.

And this site consists for about 20 percent of thorough arguments against globalism.

[WendyDarling]

We already have all the good and working ideologies we need. Individualism, rationalism, secularism, liberty and natural human rights, free market localist capitalism, and minimal government highly constrained by a Constitution into separation of powers and limited to the sole purpose of protecting the rights and freedoms of the people.

The government does not represent the people, the people represent the government, and the government's only legitimate purpose and function is to protect the rights and freedoms of the people who are representative of that social political system. I think the problem is that the Founders saw government as properly representing the people, but this puts the power and initiative in the hands of government even if only indirectly, thus no amount of safeguards in the Constitution can protect you from that government expanding forever in its necessary role and function of "representing you".

Rather, the government needs to be defined as that which the people represent: the most rational, philosophical, sane and reality-oriented compact of laws designed for the sole purpose of instantiating and protecting the rights and freedoms of the people. The people representing themselves, in other words, with government merely a symbol of that.

I agree that it should be how you framed it, but our government is corrupt and not representational of its majority but rather corporate greed.

Something new must be added into the mix so that we regain our alignment with sanity. There is no way for the citizens to police the Congress...they are free to be as corrupt as they wish to be (and that's pretty fucking corrupt currently) while in office from 2-6 years.

Who polices our Congress...themselves...that's laughable?

[URUZ]

We already have all the good and working ideologies we need. Individualism, rationalism, secularism, liberty and natural human rights, free market localist capitalism, and minimal government highly constrained by a Constitution into separation of powers and limited to the sole purpose of protecting the rights and freedoms of the people.

The government does not represent the people, the people represent the government, and the government's only legitimate purpose and function is to protect the rights and freedoms of the people who are representative of that social political system. I think the problem is that the Founders saw government as properly representing the people, but this puts the power and initiative in the hands of government even if only indirectly, thus no amount of safeguards in the Constitution can protect you from that government expanding forever in its necessary role and function of "representing you".

Rather, the government needs to be defined as that which the people represent: the most rational, philosophical, sane and reality-oriented compact of laws designed for the sole purpose of instantiating and protecting the rights and freedoms of the people. The people representing themselves, in other words, with government merely a symbol of that.

I agree that it should be how you framed it, but our government is corrupt and not representational of its majority but rather corporate greed.

Something new must be added into the mix so that we regain our alignment with sanity. There is no way for the citizens to police the Congress...they are free to be as corrupt as they wish to be (and that's pretty fucking corrupt currently) while in office from 2-6 years.

Who polices our Congress...themselves...that's laughable?

Corruption isn't even the problem. Corruption is actually desirable at a low level, you simply need to manage it from getting out of hand. What is the real problems is the very notion of "being represented" in the first place -- I do not need some fucker in a suit to represent me, I will represent myself, thank you very much. I do not need a government so dymanic and massive that it is constantly expanding and rewriting and adding to its own laws and powers under the false premise of needing to always "represent the people a little bit better". All I need is a government with a fixed number of rational, clear, sane laws and powers that does not change over time. The dynamism and "living Constitution" notion of law is absurd bullshit and just an excuse for statism.

Once we stop wanting Daddy Government to "represent" us, we can start fixing the problems. On the Left you have idiots wanting Daddy Government to literally care for them and take care of their every need and desire, while on the Right you have idiots wanting Daddy Government to exist to literally "represent them" and their every little interest and concern. In both cases you have douchebags too lazy and self-righteous to fucking stand up for themselves and care for themselves and represent their own interests. Once you rent out your capacity to represent your own interest to someone else, you are fucked, you no longer exist as a concrete, coherent entity.

[WendyDarling]

Your talking in terms of idealism not realism. Either we have a government of people who represent more people or we have no government, with literally no representation. I offered a new form of government and James S Saint offered his SAM Co-ops. An empty government has no ultimate decision makers or tie breakers and that won't do.

[URUZ]

Your talking in terms of idealism not realism. Either we have a government of people who represent more people or we have no government, with literally no representation. I offered a new form of government and James S Saint offered his SAM Co-ops. An empty government has no ultimate decision makers or tie breakers and that won't do.

What I want is a much smaller and more fixed government, one that cannot grow because it is expressly prohibited from growing, and also because there is no need for it to grow. Obviously you will have people working in whatever government functions and jobs end up existing. But the government will not exist to "care for you" nor to "represent you"; it will simply exist to carry out certain clearly delimited operations as defined by its charter or Constitution. All other functions and operations would be left to the people themselves, and to market capitalism.