Universe and Time

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Re: Universe and Time

Postby Arminius » Mon Dec 01, 2014 12:02 am

James S Saint wrote:

Did you mean four spatial dimensions? or the "space-time" dimensions?
Either way dimensions are merely mental reference constructs with no physical existence of their own.

It was your wording. So what did you mean by „four dimensional space“?
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Re: Universe and Time

Postby James S Saint » Mon Dec 01, 2014 2:10 am

Arminius wrote:
James S Saint wrote:

Did you mean four spatial dimensions? or the "space-time" dimensions?
Either way dimensions are merely mental reference constructs with no physical existence of their own.

It was your wording. So what did you mean by „four dimensional space“?

Oh, that.
No, there are not 4 spatial dimensions in physical reality. In mathematics, you can have any number arbitrarily.
Clarify, Verify, Instill, and Reinforce the Perception of Hopes and Threats unto Anentropic Harmony :)
Else
From THIS age of sleep, Homo-sapien shall never awake.

The Wise gather together to help one another in EVERY aspect of living.

You are always more insecure than you think, just not by what you think.
The only absolute certainty is formed by the absolute lack of alternatives.
It is not merely "do what works", but "to accomplish what purpose in what time frame at what cost".
As long as the authority is secretive, the population will be subjugated.

Amid the lack of certainty, put faith in the wiser to believe.
Devil's Motto: Make it look good, safe, innocent, and wise.. until it is too late to choose otherwise.

The Real God ≡ The reason/cause for the Universe being what it is = "The situation cannot be what it is and also remain as it is".
.
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Posts: 25976
Joined: Sun Apr 18, 2010 8:05 pm

Re: Universe and Time

Postby Arminius » Mon Dec 01, 2014 2:31 am

And when I wrote about Riemann's continuum I meant the spcae-and-time-continuum, thus three dimensions (space) and one dimension (time) in one continuum.
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Re: Universe and Time

Postby James S Saint » Mon Dec 01, 2014 4:11 am

Arminius wrote:And when I wrote about Riemann's continuum I meant the spcae-and-time-continuum, thus three dimensions (space) and one dimension (time) in one continuum.

To which I responded. So now I don't really know what you are asking, if anything...? RM:AO uses 3 spatial dimensions and time as either a single or a 3 dimensional concern. Relative time is treated just as any other relative/subjective measurement.
Clarify, Verify, Instill, and Reinforce the Perception of Hopes and Threats unto Anentropic Harmony :)
Else
From THIS age of sleep, Homo-sapien shall never awake.

The Wise gather together to help one another in EVERY aspect of living.

You are always more insecure than you think, just not by what you think.
The only absolute certainty is formed by the absolute lack of alternatives.
It is not merely "do what works", but "to accomplish what purpose in what time frame at what cost".
As long as the authority is secretive, the population will be subjugated.

Amid the lack of certainty, put faith in the wiser to believe.
Devil's Motto: Make it look good, safe, innocent, and wise.. until it is too late to choose otherwise.

The Real God ≡ The reason/cause for the Universe being what it is = "The situation cannot be what it is and also remain as it is".
.
James S Saint
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Posts: 25976
Joined: Sun Apr 18, 2010 8:05 pm

Re: Universe and Time

Postby Arminius » Mon Dec 01, 2014 4:36 am

James S Saint wrote:
Arminius wrote:And when I wrote about Riemann's continuum I meant the spcae-and-time-continuum, thus three dimensions (space) and one dimension (time) in one continuum.

To which I responded. So now I don't really know what you are asking, if anything...? RM:AO uses 3 spatial dimensions and time as either a single or a 3 dimensional concern. Relative time is treated just as any other relative/subjective measurement.

What do you exactly mean by "time as either a single or a 3 dimensional concern"?
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Re: Universe and Time

Postby James S Saint » Mon Dec 01, 2014 4:49 am

Arminius wrote:
James S Saint wrote:
Arminius wrote:And when I wrote about Riemann's continuum I meant the spcae-and-time-continuum, thus three dimensions (space) and one dimension (time) in one continuum.

To which I responded. So now I don't really know what you are asking, if anything...? RM:AO uses 3 spatial dimensions and time as either a single or a 3 dimensional concern. Relative time is treated just as any other relative/subjective measurement.

What do you exactly mean by "time as either a single or a 3 dimensional concern"?

Time is the measure of change. In today's physics, time is given a single dimension with which to measure all change. But note that space is given 3 dimensions in which those changes can occur. The reality is that affects can change at different paces in different directions during the same span of time. As one affect is propagating from right to left, another might be propagating from top to bottom and another forward to back. The speed of their propagation might be different and thus produce a different change-rate in each direction, a different measure of change, "time", for each direction.

This issue is one of precise accuracy. Three dimensional time provides greater accuracy than 4D relativity, but is very seldom required.
Clarify, Verify, Instill, and Reinforce the Perception of Hopes and Threats unto Anentropic Harmony :)
Else
From THIS age of sleep, Homo-sapien shall never awake.

The Wise gather together to help one another in EVERY aspect of living.

You are always more insecure than you think, just not by what you think.
The only absolute certainty is formed by the absolute lack of alternatives.
It is not merely "do what works", but "to accomplish what purpose in what time frame at what cost".
As long as the authority is secretive, the population will be subjugated.

Amid the lack of certainty, put faith in the wiser to believe.
Devil's Motto: Make it look good, safe, innocent, and wise.. until it is too late to choose otherwise.

The Real God ≡ The reason/cause for the Universe being what it is = "The situation cannot be what it is and also remain as it is".
.
James S Saint
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Posts: 25976
Joined: Sun Apr 18, 2010 8:05 pm

Re: Universe and Time

Postby Arminius » Mon Dec 01, 2014 5:03 am

James S Saint wrote:Time is the measure of change. In today's physics, time is given a single dimension with which to measure all change. But note that space is given 3 dimensions in which those changes can occur. The reality is that affects can change at different paces in different directions during the same span of time. As one affect is propagating from right to left, another might be propagating from top to bottom and another forward to back. The speed of their propagation might be different and thus produce a different change-rate in each direction, a different measure of change, "time", for each direction.

This issue is one of precise accuracy. Three dimensional time provides greater accuracy than 4D relativity, but is very seldom required.

So according to RM:AO you have either a three-dimensional-time or a one-dimensional-time.
Last edited by Arminius on Mon Dec 01, 2014 5:06 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Universe and Time

Postby James S Saint » Mon Dec 01, 2014 5:05 am

Arminius wrote:
James S Saint wrote:Time is the measure of change. In today's physics, time is given a single dimension with which to measure all change. But note that space is given 3 dimensions in which those changes can occur. The reality is that affects can change at different paces in different directions during the same span of time. As one affect is propagating from right to left, another might be propagating from top to bottom and another forward to back. The speed of their propagation might be different and thus produce a different change-rate in each direction, a different measure of change, "time", for each direction.

This issue is one of precise accuracy. Three dimensional time provides greater accuracy than 4D relativity, but is very seldom required.

So according to RM:AO you have either a three-dimesional-time or a one-dimesional-time.

Yes, just like you can use spherical coordinates or Cartesian coordinates. It doesn't change the reality of the situation, merely the manner in which it is being recorded or measured. And you can switch back and forth as long as you don't get them conflated.
Clarify, Verify, Instill, and Reinforce the Perception of Hopes and Threats unto Anentropic Harmony :)
Else
From THIS age of sleep, Homo-sapien shall never awake.

The Wise gather together to help one another in EVERY aspect of living.

You are always more insecure than you think, just not by what you think.
The only absolute certainty is formed by the absolute lack of alternatives.
It is not merely "do what works", but "to accomplish what purpose in what time frame at what cost".
As long as the authority is secretive, the population will be subjugated.

Amid the lack of certainty, put faith in the wiser to believe.
Devil's Motto: Make it look good, safe, innocent, and wise.. until it is too late to choose otherwise.

The Real God ≡ The reason/cause for the Universe being what it is = "The situation cannot be what it is and also remain as it is".
.
James S Saint
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Posts: 25976
Joined: Sun Apr 18, 2010 8:05 pm

Re: Universe and Time

Postby Arminius » Tue Dec 23, 2014 12:44 pm

One can switch back and forth between the one- and the three-dimensional-time?
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Re: Universe and Time

Postby James S Saint » Tue Dec 23, 2014 1:57 pm

Arminius wrote:One can switch back and forth between the one- and the three-dimensional-time?

Time is the measure of relative changing.

With respect your changing another person is;
1) changing in the Y direction twice as fast
2) changing in the X direction equally (one)
3) changing in the Z direction not at all

Thus the average changing is equal to your own (zero single dimension time dilation) and thus a single dimension of time would be recorded as showing no difference from you. Using a single dimension for time is a little more primitive.

But in reality, the subject would be altering in a way that would contort its configuration differently than you and the reason for it would be hidden. Using a single dimension for time hides changing variables and promotes mysticism and fantasy physics. It keeps science a little more confused (not that Quantum Phantasy Physics and Relativity were not enough).
Clarify, Verify, Instill, and Reinforce the Perception of Hopes and Threats unto Anentropic Harmony :)
Else
From THIS age of sleep, Homo-sapien shall never awake.

The Wise gather together to help one another in EVERY aspect of living.

You are always more insecure than you think, just not by what you think.
The only absolute certainty is formed by the absolute lack of alternatives.
It is not merely "do what works", but "to accomplish what purpose in what time frame at what cost".
As long as the authority is secretive, the population will be subjugated.

Amid the lack of certainty, put faith in the wiser to believe.
Devil's Motto: Make it look good, safe, innocent, and wise.. until it is too late to choose otherwise.

The Real God ≡ The reason/cause for the Universe being what it is = "The situation cannot be what it is and also remain as it is".
.
James S Saint
ILP Legend
 
Posts: 25976
Joined: Sun Apr 18, 2010 8:05 pm

Re: Universe and Time

Postby Arminius » Wed Dec 24, 2014 11:21 pm

Do you geometrically mean this?:

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Re: Universe and Time

Postby James S Saint » Thu Dec 25, 2014 12:00 am

That could be one example. The inner box has X axis motion, but not Z or Y. And even though the whole is not moving relative to the bottom object, the inner box would also have time dilation, perplexing special relativity if they could not see the inner movement.

Space is given 3 dimensions for location.
Motion is given 3 dimensions for direction.
Time can also be given 3 dimensions for vector of relative changing.

This comes into play when trying to justify special relativity with general relativity, motion dilation vs gravitational dilation. Motion time dilation is concerned with one vector of motion and thus only one dimension of relative changing. Gravitation or more properly mass field density (affectance density) affects in all 3 dimensions simultaneously.
Clarify, Verify, Instill, and Reinforce the Perception of Hopes and Threats unto Anentropic Harmony :)
Else
From THIS age of sleep, Homo-sapien shall never awake.

The Wise gather together to help one another in EVERY aspect of living.

You are always more insecure than you think, just not by what you think.
The only absolute certainty is formed by the absolute lack of alternatives.
It is not merely "do what works", but "to accomplish what purpose in what time frame at what cost".
As long as the authority is secretive, the population will be subjugated.

Amid the lack of certainty, put faith in the wiser to believe.
Devil's Motto: Make it look good, safe, innocent, and wise.. until it is too late to choose otherwise.

The Real God ≡ The reason/cause for the Universe being what it is = "The situation cannot be what it is and also remain as it is".
.
James S Saint
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Posts: 25976
Joined: Sun Apr 18, 2010 8:05 pm

Re: Universe and Time

Postby Arminius » Thu Jan 08, 2015 12:15 am

Image

Does moving really be a part of geometry?
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Re: Universe and Time

Postby James S Saint » Fri Jan 09, 2015 6:25 pm

Arminius wrote:Image

Does moving really be a part of geometry?

Could you rephrase that question? :-k
Clarify, Verify, Instill, and Reinforce the Perception of Hopes and Threats unto Anentropic Harmony :)
Else
From THIS age of sleep, Homo-sapien shall never awake.

The Wise gather together to help one another in EVERY aspect of living.

You are always more insecure than you think, just not by what you think.
The only absolute certainty is formed by the absolute lack of alternatives.
It is not merely "do what works", but "to accomplish what purpose in what time frame at what cost".
As long as the authority is secretive, the population will be subjugated.

Amid the lack of certainty, put faith in the wiser to believe.
Devil's Motto: Make it look good, safe, innocent, and wise.. until it is too late to choose otherwise.

The Real God ≡ The reason/cause for the Universe being what it is = "The situation cannot be what it is and also remain as it is".
.
James S Saint
ILP Legend
 
Posts: 25976
Joined: Sun Apr 18, 2010 8:05 pm

Re: Universe and Time

Postby Ecmandu » Fri Jan 09, 2015 7:06 pm

James S Saint wrote:That could be one example. The inner box has X axis motion, but not Z or Y. And even though the whole is not moving relative to the bottom object, the inner box would also have time dilation, perplexing special relativity if they could not see the inner movement.

Space is given 3 dimensions for location.
Motion is given 3 dimensions for direction.
Time can also be given 3 dimensions for vector of relative changing.

This comes into play when trying to justify special relativity with general relativity, motion dilation vs gravitational dilation. Motion time dilation is concerned with one vector of motion and thus only one dimension of relative changing. Gravitation or more properly mass field density (affectance density) affects in all 3 dimensions simultaneously.


Translation.. Contradiction. If gravity effects all 3 fields than it is a fourth field.
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Re: Universe and Time

Postby Arminius » Sun Jan 11, 2015 4:49 am

James S Saint wrote:
Arminius wrote:Image

Does moving really be a part of geometry?

Could you rephrase that question? :-k

Yes.

The figure in that picture moves, but geometric figures are actually immobile. So, it is a question of definition, of definional logic. If you want to describe a geometrical figure, then you actually do only consider that that figure is static, thus that that figure is immobile.

In this thread we are mainly talking about the philsophical meaning of physics and about physics itself; so moving bodies are one of the main physical premises; but moving bodies are not the main geometrical premises (this does not mean that it is impossible to have also moving bodies as a premise in geometry); so we have to be careful and should not combine physics and mathematics too much. Combining physics and mathematics too much has been being a problem of the physicists for so long - since the 20th century, especially since the second half of the 20th century. Another example is the problem of combining economics and mathematics too much, and this problem has been existing since the second half of the 20th century (we can talk about it in another thread). I do not say that we should not do it, but we should be careful with that. I argue not against the mathematics but against the domination of the megalomania in physicis, economics, and some other scientific disciplines.
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Re: Universe and Time

Postby James S Saint » Mon Jan 12, 2015 11:35 pm

I agree that geometry refers merely to fixed shapes. And mathematics refers merely to the logic between quantities. Thus neither can ever describe physical reality on their own. Physical reality is the changing of the changing wherein nothing is truly quantifiable nor fixed except on a macro/categorical mental scale (the crude map).
Clarify, Verify, Instill, and Reinforce the Perception of Hopes and Threats unto Anentropic Harmony :)
Else
From THIS age of sleep, Homo-sapien shall never awake.

The Wise gather together to help one another in EVERY aspect of living.

You are always more insecure than you think, just not by what you think.
The only absolute certainty is formed by the absolute lack of alternatives.
It is not merely "do what works", but "to accomplish what purpose in what time frame at what cost".
As long as the authority is secretive, the population will be subjugated.

Amid the lack of certainty, put faith in the wiser to believe.
Devil's Motto: Make it look good, safe, innocent, and wise.. until it is too late to choose otherwise.

The Real God ≡ The reason/cause for the Universe being what it is = "The situation cannot be what it is and also remain as it is".
.
James S Saint
ILP Legend
 
Posts: 25976
Joined: Sun Apr 18, 2010 8:05 pm

Re: Universe and Time

Postby Arminius » Tue Jan 13, 2015 6:35 pm

It's interesting that you said "that there are more points in space than there are points in time":

James S Saint wrote:What it boils down to is that there are more points in space than there are points in time. What that means is that if you went through a new situation for each moment of an infinite amount of time, you would still have more than an infinite amount of situations not yet specified. In fact, you would have infA^2 or more untried situations.

So the bottom line is that given a single small area of space, it is possible that even through an infinite amount of time, a frog will never be in that small space.

And that provides for an eternity of evolution that never, ever repeated itself. And interestingly, never began ... :lol:
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Re: Universe and Time

Postby Ecmandu » Tue Jan 13, 2015 6:39 pm

Arminius wrote:It's interesting that you said "that there are more points in space than there are points in time":

James S Saint wrote:What it boils down to is that there are more points in space than there are points in time. What that means is that if you went through a new situation for each moment of an infinite amount of time, you would still have more than an infinite amount of situations not yet specified. In fact, you would have infA^2 or more untried situations.

So the bottom line is that given a single small area of space, it is possible that even through an infinite amount of time, a frog will never be in that small space.

And that provides for an eternity of evolution that never, ever repeated itself. And interestingly, never began ... :lol:


I thought that was interesting too. This came up in another between James and I.
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Re: Universe and Time

Postby Arminius » Tue Jan 13, 2015 6:45 pm

Ecmandu wrote:
Arminius wrote:It's interesting that you said "that there are more points in space than there are points in time":

James S Saint wrote:What it boils down to is that there are more points in space than there are points in time. What that means is that if you went through a new situation for each moment of an infinite amount of time, you would still have more than an infinite amount of situations not yet specified. In fact, you would have infA^2 or more untried situations.

So the bottom line is that given a single small area of space, it is possible that even through an infinite amount of time, a frog will never be in that small space.

And that provides for an eternity of evolution that never, ever repeated itself. And interestingly, never began ... :lol:


I thought that was interesting too. This came up in another between James and I.

And what was the result?
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Re: Universe and Time

Postby James S Saint » Tue Jan 13, 2015 7:00 pm

Space has infA^6 first order points (or more precisely: 4/3 Pi*((infA^2)/2)^3) whereas
time only has infA^2 first order points.

That is an extremely significant difference, especially concerning why the universe has substance, "exists".
Clarify, Verify, Instill, and Reinforce the Perception of Hopes and Threats unto Anentropic Harmony :)
Else
From THIS age of sleep, Homo-sapien shall never awake.

The Wise gather together to help one another in EVERY aspect of living.

You are always more insecure than you think, just not by what you think.
The only absolute certainty is formed by the absolute lack of alternatives.
It is not merely "do what works", but "to accomplish what purpose in what time frame at what cost".
As long as the authority is secretive, the population will be subjugated.

Amid the lack of certainty, put faith in the wiser to believe.
Devil's Motto: Make it look good, safe, innocent, and wise.. until it is too late to choose otherwise.

The Real God ≡ The reason/cause for the Universe being what it is = "The situation cannot be what it is and also remain as it is".
.
James S Saint
ILP Legend
 
Posts: 25976
Joined: Sun Apr 18, 2010 8:05 pm

Re: Universe and Time

Postby Ecmandu » Tue Jan 13, 2015 7:34 pm

James S Saint wrote:Space has infA^6 first order points (or more precisely: 4/3 Pi*((infA^2)/2)^3) whereas
time only has infA^2 first order points.

That is an extremely significant difference, especially concerning why the universe has substance, "exists".


I don't think there are orders of infinity. I don't know how you came to this result, but I do know that if time and space are both infinite, there are not orders to them to that regard.

Are you saying that the completeness of a sequence is an order of infinity?

Say...

2,4,6,8,10,12,14,16,18,20,22,24,26,28.....

vs...

1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10,11,12,13,14, 15.....

Are you saying one set is twice as large as the other set?
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Re: Universe and Time

Postby James S Saint » Tue Jan 13, 2015 8:07 pm

Ecmandu wrote:
James S Saint wrote:Space has infA^6 first order points (or more precisely: 4/3 Pi*((infA^2)/2)^3) whereas
time only has infA^2 first order points.

That is an extremely significant difference, especially concerning why the universe has substance, "exists".


I don't think there are orders of infinity. I don't know how you came to this result, but I do know that if time and space are both infinite, there are not orders to them to that regard.

Are you saying that the completeness of a sequence is an order of infinity?

Say...

2,4,6,8,10,12,14,16,18,20,22,24,26,28.....

vs...

1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10,11,12,13,14, 15.....

Are you saying one set is twice as large as the other set?

In mathematics, infinity has both cardinalities and orders (exponential powers).

An infinite sequence can be greater or lesser than another and thus alter the cardinality (de Georg Cantor) of the "relative greatness of its infinity".

But in addition to being merely greater or lesser, infinity can be raised to exponential powers, such as infA^2 (ref Edward Hewitt, Hyperreal Numbers)

A line in space can be ordered into the "real number" set, thus having infA^2 points. But that is only one of 3 dimensions. By including the other two dimensions, that line becomes a plane with infA^4 points and then a cube of infA^6 points.

Those are the "first order" points because merely the real number set was used to number the original points (even though there are infA^6 of them, requiring a higher order to individually number the first order points). But between any two infinitesimals ("1/infA") can be an entirely new number set. Thus creating the range of "1/infA^2" up through infA^2 on a line. That constitutes a second order point referencing system. And that pattern can be continued indefinitely to any higher order. Thus there is no "absolute highest order of infinity", no "absolute infinity", and interestingly no "absolute zero".
Clarify, Verify, Instill, and Reinforce the Perception of Hopes and Threats unto Anentropic Harmony :)
Else
From THIS age of sleep, Homo-sapien shall never awake.

The Wise gather together to help one another in EVERY aspect of living.

You are always more insecure than you think, just not by what you think.
The only absolute certainty is formed by the absolute lack of alternatives.
It is not merely "do what works", but "to accomplish what purpose in what time frame at what cost".
As long as the authority is secretive, the population will be subjugated.

Amid the lack of certainty, put faith in the wiser to believe.
Devil's Motto: Make it look good, safe, innocent, and wise.. until it is too late to choose otherwise.

The Real God ≡ The reason/cause for the Universe being what it is = "The situation cannot be what it is and also remain as it is".
.
James S Saint
ILP Legend
 
Posts: 25976
Joined: Sun Apr 18, 2010 8:05 pm

Re: Universe and Time

Postby Ecmandu » Tue Jan 13, 2015 8:11 pm

Ecmandu wrote:
James S Saint wrote:Space has infA^6 first order points (or more precisely: 4/3 Pi*((infA^2)/2)^3) whereas
time only has infA^2 first order points.

That is an extremely significant difference, especially concerning why the universe has substance, "exists".


I don't think there are orders of infinity. I don't know how you came to this result, but I do know that if time and space are both infinite, there are not orders to them to that regard.

Are you saying that the completeness of a sequence is an order of infinity?

Say...

2,4,6,8,10,12,14,16,18,20,22,24,26,28.....

vs...

1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10,11,12,13,14, 15.....

Are you saying one set is twice as large as the other set?


This is just exclusion in terms of orders of infinity... but you can also do overlap....

1,1,2,2,3,3,4,4,5,5,6,6,7,7,8,8,9,9,10,10.... etc.... is this a larger set than

1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10...

?
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Re: Universe and Time

Postby Ecmandu » Tue Jan 13, 2015 8:17 pm

James S Saint wrote:
Ecmandu wrote:
James S Saint wrote:Space has infA^6 first order points (or more precisely: 4/3 Pi*((infA^2)/2)^3) whereas
time only has infA^2 first order points.

That is an extremely significant difference, especially concerning why the universe has substance, "exists".


I don't think there are orders of infinity. I don't know how you came to this result, but I do know that if time and space are both infinite, there are not orders to them to that regard.

Are you saying that the completeness of a sequence is an order of infinity?

Say...

2,4,6,8,10,12,14,16,18,20,22,24,26,28.....

vs...

1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10,11,12,13,14, 15.....

Are you saying one set is twice as large as the other set?

In mathematics, infinity has both cardinalities and orders (exponential powers).

An infinite sequence can be greater or lesser than another and thus alter the cardinality (de Georg Cantor) of the "relative greatness of its infinity".

But in addition to being merely greater or lesser, infinity can be raised to exponential powers, such as infA^2 (ref Edward Hewitt, Hyperreal Numbers)

A line in space can be ordered into the "real number" set, thus having infA^2 points. But that is only one of 3 dimensions. By including the other two dimensions, that line becomes a plane with infA^4 points and then a cube of infA^6 points.

Those are the "first order" points because merely the real number set was used to number the original points (even though there are infA^6 of them, requiring a higher order to individually number the first order points). But between any two infinitesimals ("1/infA") can be an entirely new number set. Thus creating the range of "1/infA^2" up through infA^2 on a line. That constitutes a second order point referencing system. And that pattern can be continued indefinitely to any higher order. Thus there is no "absolute highest order of infinity", no "absolute infinity", and interestingly no "absolute zero".


This is an excerpt from my introduction post to this site...

By definition of infinity, there is no highest order of infinity, and it is false that they cannot be counted... you can list any sequence with an algorithm... if the algorithm itself has infinite processing time, then there is no sequence. Cantor and Chaitin were wrong.

It's considered a mathematical proof ala Cantor from over 140 years ago that all of the real numbers cannot be counted...

I use a techinique called 1 dimensional flooding to show that all of the reals cannot be counted in one list with one dimension, which is differnt than Cantors diagonalization argument.

use the lists..

012345678910...
123456789101...
234567891011...
345678910111...
456789101112...
567891011121...
678910111213...

etc...

To do one dimensional flooding, you simply add an infinite list to each place in the previous infinite list...

024681012151...
036912151821...
048121620242...
051015202530...

When the list converges at infinity, there is no way to begin counting...

12345678910...
13579111315...
14812162024...

Because you never pass the zero's.

This is the proof that we cannot determine the limit of how much we can count.

Sorry forgot to add the disproof of Cantor's diagonalization argument...

Once you do one dimensional flooding, you have to expand to another dimension to keep listing the sequences... diagonals can be subsumed by a third dimension, say list 1.1, or list 5.7 etc... or a 4th dimension 1..1, 5..7, etc...

It's actually easy to absorb the diagonals by starting from the center and listing them from top to bottom in sequence using another dimension... what this means is that cantors proof that you cannot count all the reals is false. It also means that you cannot find the limit on what can be calculated!!!!!!!!! except that it cannot be everything!!!!!!!!!

Basically, James, what this means, is that there are no powers to infinity, each dimensional flooding is just as large as another dimensional flooding.
Ecmandu
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