Thoughts about Bart D. Ehrman"s book “Heaven and Hell”. 2020, p155
“One of my theses is that a close reading of Jesus’s words shows that in fact
he had no idea of torment for sinners after death. Death, for them, is
irreversible, the end of the story. Their punishment is that they will be
annihilated, never to exist again, unlike the saved, who will live forever
in God’s glorious kingdom.”–Ehrman.
Most problems seem to arise from poor translations and poor understanding of what Jesus is talking about.
For example, Gehenna is translated as ‘hell’. Supposedly it is the garbage dump outside of Jerusalem when rubbish is continuously burned. But if look at the research, the reality seems to be very different.
Here is some research:
bibleplaces.com/blog/2011/0 … -scholars/
What would people 2000 years ago, or the translators working hundreds of years ago, know about the place? Not much.
Good points.
Gehenna got its claim to infamy as the valley where people sacrificed their children to the Gods Moloch and Baal. The parents burned their children.
The Valley is not still burning, hence no everlasting fires therein.
How does Ehrman make his case?
Ehrman examines the history of these ideas (reward and punishment) in the context of what people near the time of Jesus wrote.
Jesus spoke mostly in parables, which cannot be taken literally.
I have about 30 pages left in reading Ehrman’s book. So, I’ll be able to comment more when I read his conclusions. Bear with me.
Phyllo’s post was a good start.
I’m having difficulty typing. Must rest.
If you want to discuss Gehenna, go here, click all the verses, in them click on all their commentaries.
biblehub.com/greek/strongs_1067.htm
Stretches back to Valley of Hinnom. That’s OT stuff.
Hell — on earth — is when you’ve absolutely lost all perspective to the point you are eating/sacrificing children.
Or, say, using/selling them for parts/sex.
Too late? Too soon?
God knows.
If this be the case, why does the image of hell have such a psychological grip on so many people who are terrorized by images of it and/or terrorize others with it?
Please read the book and see.
Good points.
People, believing there is no justice in this life in the world, proclaimed the existence of another world after death in which justice could be served. And when their reward the promised kingdom of God did not appear in their lifetimes, they believed rewards and punishments would occur immediately after death. For some, the thought of afterlife torture was seen as a deterrent from sinning, the more frightening the better chance of its effectiveness. Ehrman notes 'it was not to scare the hell out of people; it was to scare the people out of hell." It is remarkable that this idea persists in 21st century USA.
Well, there’s lots of injustice in 21st century USA.
Just think the fact this is a philosophy forum would be a great opportunity to lay out his argument.
Yes, but in order to stop it would you tell your toddler child that he, having done some minor infraction of your rules, deserves to be beaten for the rest of his life? Ehrman brings up the problem of degrees of sin and punishment in ideas that suggest the origins of Purgatory.
duplicate
It’s a history. I’ll be glad to comment on your take on it.
It’s not strange that people believe in some sort of punishment after death.
I wonder how many of them believe in “eternal punishment”. They could be blindly repeating the party line. Maybe if they thought about it, they would concede that enough is enough.
That’s how we got purgatory and limbo … people thought that some cases really didn’t deserve eternal damnation, so they tweaked it. (That and the profit motive of the church. 
)
“a minor infraction” … that misses the point. He didn’t come to heal the healthy. When you realize you’re spiritually sick and seemingly beyond the point of no return… remember. When nothing satisfies, but you’re still hungry… remember.
What is your point?
Fear is a great motivator. It regularly motivates the gospel preachers to literally stand in the street In front of the gas station in the city where I live with signs preaching that believing in Jesus is the only means of saving people from the eternal fires of hell. If they thought that following Jesus’ teaching would merely make people better or live more meaningful lives, would they stand out there with signs about it?
According to Augustinian theology we are all carriers of original sin. Without grace it is impossible not to sin.