Philosophy For Us Dummies

Why follow beliefs, when you can follow facts.

None of us truly know anything at all. Humanity has barely scratched the surface of knowledge.

The first statement is false.
The second is true, which is why we have beliefs.

How exactly is it false? Many people follow beliefs, some beliefs being the interpretations of facts, but this does not mean they are facts. A fact is indisputable and undeniably the case, it cannot be argued because it is. Most of the time or always, a belief isn’t what is, it is what is believed to be. (Interpretation). Can we not discover fact without belief?

“It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it.”
-Aristotle

Belief is acceptance.

be·lief
bəˈlēf/
noun
noun: belief; plural noun: beliefs
1.
an acceptance that a statement is true or that something exists.
“his belief in the value of hard work”
something one accepts as true or real; a firmly held opinion or conviction.
“contrary to popular belief, Aramaic is a living language”
synonyms: opinion, view, conviction, judgment, thinking, way of thinking, idea, impression, theory, conclusion, notion
“it’s my belief that age is irrelevant”
a religious conviction.
“Christian beliefs”
synonyms: ideology, principle, ethic, tenet, canon; More
2.
trust, faith, or confidence in someone or something.
“a belief in democratic politics”
synonyms: faith, trust, reliance, confidence, credence
“belief in the value of hard work”
antonyms: disbelief, doubt

Is that right?
You know it in spite of :

:confused:

Just because we know little to nothing does not mean what we do know isn’t factual. Said we barely scratched the surface of knowledge, because there is an ocean of it. Anyone wanna go swimming? :laughing:

“I am the wisest man alive, for I know one thing, and that is that I know nothing.”
Socrates

How do you know that the vast ocean of the unknown does not contain facts which invalidate the facts that you know now?

Then that would negate them as facts wouldn’t it? I have not explained the facts of which I know now, nor have I given many examples if not any. Time, place, people and the like can change. Fact’s don’t.

Good to know. :smiley:

So they are not real facts now. :-k

I tried explaining that facts do not change but time/place does on the other philosophy forum that I was on and they kept trying to give me examples of facts changing, such as “Oh, well I went to high school in 1980 but I am not in high school anymore, this is an example of the facts changing.” No, the fact of them going to high school did not change, the time however did. It is still factual that they went to high school in 1980 correct? Just because they are out of school now, does not negate the fact that they were once IN school. It’s just historical or past tense fact now.

Another example being “The capital of Maryland is Annapolis, if the capital changed, the fact regarding Annapolis as the capital of Maryland would change as well.” Not true, Annapolis would of still been the capital of Maryland at one point in time, the change through time and place would not negate the fact that Annapolis WAS the capital. :slight_smile: Just because it is no longer the capital, does not cancel the fact that it indeed was the capital.

I deal with blatant correlating facts. Such as for example children being natural creative, wondering opportunists and risk takers. Yet they are also naturally gullible, gullibility of which is most often taken advantage of by dominant teachings/faiths/beliefs/and ways of operating or performing tasks. It is a fact that children are naturally gullible, even some adults remain so.

I will give an example of interpretation of ‘fact’ as well. For example, the people used to believe that the world was flat as a fact. When truly it never was a fact to begin with, it was the interpretation and belief of it being a fact. Of which was disproved later on in time.

^ this last example is not equivalent to being past tense fact because it was never truly a fact, the planet was always round, regardless of what they interpreted or believed.

We only have you word for it. We could search the school records and we may find that someone with your name went to that school. Is it a fact that it was you?
And what happens if the records are destroyed? What are the facts then?
That ties into your post about the existence of Jesus. You claim that he did not exist and others claim that he did. What is the real fact in that situation?

People start out with simple (even trivial) facts and they end up believing that all facts have the same properties.

You generalize about a large population. Is that fact true for the individual and within a particular context? And isn’t gullibility a range behaviors?

There is a difference between what physically is and what we know (or believe) to be. All thought and knowledge is an interpretation of physical reality. It’s possible to be wrong in that interpretation. None the less, that interpretation (right or wrong) is said to be fact at the time. What happens in the future is irrelevant to the present.

Children in general… are gullible… You can spoon feed them a fairy tale/story and they will most likely adopt and believe it. Similarly, like when you tell children to go Snipe hunting in the woods and they do, even when there are no such things as Snipes.

I am not claiming it as fact or not, I am claiming that it is not viable evidence to claim that he does exist at all, because it isn’t, it’s hear say. 7-20 years after his death records suddenly pop up? Why not 1-2 years or perhaps at the time of his life? Makes no logical or reasonable sense.

Well they could ask the individual questions regarding the going to high school in 1980, what class, what prom theme, what teachers/classes, the correlations between the individuals age and schooling period, perhaps school ID, etc. Besides, a person can lie, but their DNA/Blood doesn’t.

What is there to interpret about what has happened, what is happening and the like?

So what are you saying? Do you know things about Jesus or do you believe things about Jesus?
This is fundamental to the concepts of belief, knowledge, evidence and facts. Isn’t it?

What does DNA/blood have to do with facts about attending school?

Depends on what it is. Memories are incomplete. People interpret the present based on expectations … that’s why magic tricks work.
What is actually happening for a schizophrenic?

“We only have you word for it. We could search the school records and we may find that someone with your name went to that school. Is it a fact that it was you?
And what happens if the records are destroyed? What are the facts then?
That ties into your post about the existence of Jesus. You claim that he did not exist and others claim that he did. What is the real fact in that situation?”

“Is it a fact that it was you?” DNA/Blood and genetic material does not lie, so yes it could prove that it was the individual.

Do we rely on schizoprenics interpretation of “fact”, do we put schizoprenics as historical scholars?

What I do know about Jesus is that there is no viable evidence in today’s time and era to regard if he even existed at all, it’s hear say and hear say is not evidence.

You do realize that genetic material testing requires comparison to another sample? The school collected your DNA? That’s just weird.

You were talking about interpretations strictly with respect to the historical Jesus?
Oh.

And how does that fit into you ideas about facts and knowledge?
Maybe we don’t have enough evidence to claim knowledge about the situation but enough to form legitimate beliefs.

Parental enrollment? Or is your counter going to be you walked in and enrolled yourself next?
Why believe at all if there is no evidence, it seems like a waste of time of which we don’t really have, but it definitely has us. You have one “Historian” in Rome, how is that enough to form legitimate beliefs, especially regarding such a “Divine” and supposedly influential being.

What are you talking about “need a sample or school collecting your DNA”, you said how would the school know it was you. I am saying you can prove who you are by genetic material in a last resort if needed. You did not say “What if the school didn’t know you were ever enrolled” You asked, how would the school know it was you. I don’t know… perhaps I.D, blatant correlations, parental enrollment/DNA. Medical records from a doctor to prove it’s you? Yearbooks of which have yours and mostly every other students picture? What if a student bought it, how then would the records of been destroyed?

How can you compare today with internet and all to the time of “Jesus” in the first place. This is the reason we don’t advance as fast as we could/should, people like to feed off of the old instead of focusing on the new.

“You asked, how would the school know it was you.”

No I didn’t.

You were telling somebody on the internet that you went to a school.

They only have your word for it. They could check school records but how do they know that you are the one in the records. If the records are lost, then there are no facts about what happened.

where are you guys going with this…this is the dummy site…

Already gave more than enough points for them to tell it was you. I didn’t say me, I said an individual tried using that argument on me. It is still a fact regardless. That is if the person was telling the truth, if they indeed did go to school in 1980.

If they check school records I said they could DNA test between family and the individual to prove that it is the person with that name, or ID, yearbooks, and etc. It is hardly if not at all comparable to the idea of “Jesus”.

“We only have you word for it. We could search the school records and we may find that someone with your name went to that school. Is it a fact that it was you?”

This is what you said ^

“Is it a fact that it was you?” You are pretty much asking how the school would know if it was them or not. Of which I provided explanation for.

It was the discussion about fact vs belief. Sorry to post so much about it. lol