Moderator: Dan~
Greatest I am wrote:Satan gave man love. Was it worth the hate?
Adam thought so. He instantly and without argument or hesitation ate of that knowledge when Eve offered love to Adam.
Without Satan causing Original Sin, mankind could no know of love or hate as love and hate are subject to being good or evil.
Would you do as Adam did?
Was Satan right in opening our eyes to love and hate?
Should we venerate Satan more than Yahweh who tried to deny mankind love?
Regards
DL
phyllo wrote:There was no love before Adam and Eve ate the fruit???
Says who?
felix dakat wrote:Greatest I am wrote:Satan gave man love. Was it worth the hate?
Adam thought so. He instantly and without argument or hesitation ate of that knowledge when Eve offered love to Adam.
Without Satan causing Original Sin, mankind could no know of love or hate as love and hate are subject to being good or evil.
Would you do as Adam did?
Was Satan right in opening our eyes to love and hate?
Should we venerate Satan more than Yahweh who tried to deny mankind love?
Regards
DL
Good question, bro. It's so hard to think to the ground of being below dualism like love and hate. To use the lingo of psychobabble love and hate are enmeshed like co-dependent lovers. Tradition has it that Eve seduced him. The traditional interpretation is androcentric. But, why do you think the serpent was Satan?The Genesis text doesn't say so.
Ierrellus wrote:The Serpent is the evolving of the reptilian brain. See Paul MacLean on the tripartite human brain.
Then how is one to interpret your statement : "Satan gave man love." ?phyllo wrote:
There was no love before Adam and Eve ate the fruit???
Says who?
That is not what I said.
Of course they could. They felt without judgement and without conscious awareness. They loved "as little children".Could A & E love without the knowledge of whether love was good or evil?
Greatest I am wrote:Ierrellus wrote:The Serpent is the evolving of the reptilian brain. See Paul MacLean on the tripartite human brain.
I think we evolved from a rodent, not a reptile.
Regards
DL
Rodents are mammals. Hence there is no contradiction in saying we evolved from rodents and reptiles (the former itself coming from the latter)Ierrellus wrote:Greatest I am wrote:Ierrellus wrote:The Serpent is the evolving of the reptilian brain. See Paul MacLean on the tripartite human brain.
I think we evolved from a rodent, not a reptile.
Regards
DL
Science claims otherwise. The brain base is reptilian. We do not create stories as seen through the eyes of a rodent. If that were the case and our first brain growth was rodent, the serpent in the garden would be a rat. We see what we are comprised of.
phyllo wrote:Then how is one to interpret your statement : "Satan gave man love." ?phyllo wrote:
There was no love before Adam and Eve ate the fruit???
Says who?
That is not what I said.Of course they could. They felt without judgement and without conscious awareness. They loved "as little children".Could A & E love without the knowledge of whether love was good or evil?
Ierrellus wrote:Greatest I am wrote:Ierrellus wrote:The Serpent is the evolving of the reptilian brain. See Paul MacLean on the tripartite human brain.
I think we evolved from a rodent, not a reptile.
Regards
DL
Science claims otherwise. The brain base is reptilian. We do not create stories as seen through the eyes of a rodent. If that were the case and our first brain growth was rodent, the serpent in the garden would be a rat. We see what we are comprised of.
God gave them all the working biological bits so I don't see any reason why they would not eventually conceive a child if they had stayed in the garden.Yes, who could never procreate, which is a spiritual confirmation that they know how to love fully. That is a part of our biological nature.
IOW, their could not get to a full blown love without eating of the knowledge of what true love is to a biological unit that must reproduce to sustain itself.
phyllo wrote:God gave them all the working biological bits so I don't see any reason why they would not eventually conceive a child if they had stayed in the garden.Yes, who could never procreate, which is a spiritual confirmation that they know how to love fully. That is a part of our biological nature.
IOW, their could not get to a full blown love without eating of the knowledge of what true love is to a biological unit that must reproduce to sustain itself.
How long was it?You think they would wait that long? Why?
What good and evil components?Procreation has both good and evil components and E & E could not know anything of procreation till after consuming the knowledge. Obviously.
phyllo wrote:How long was it?You think they would wait that long? Why?What good and evil components?Procreation has both good and evil components and E & E could not know anything of procreation till after consuming the knowledge. Obviously.
What's obvious?
You put Genesis chapter 1 and Genesis chapter 3. Chapters are not units of time.What I put.
Rape?Some components that come to mind are rape as compared to a love generated encounter.
phyllo wrote:You put Genesis chapter 1 and Genesis chapter 3. Chapters are not units of time.What I put.Rape?Some components that come to mind are rape as compared to a love generated encounter.
There was nothing written about that in Genesis. And if Adam was raping Eve then God would have straightened it out. Right?
So they really did not need knowledge of good and evil for procreation.
Ierrellus wrote:IMHO, the thread still lacks a credible definition of hate as applied to Adam's and Eve's awakening into consequences of behavior.
That can't be correct because it would prevent them from doing literally anything. They couldn't pick up a stick because it might be used to hit someone or poke out an eye. They couldn't use their hands because hands can be used to strangle someone. Feet ... kicking someone. Etc.That is not what the story says. It says they could not because they lacked the knowledge of anything that had good or evil applications. That would include procreation and sexual matters.
Well said, and further they even seemed to find mere nakedness sinful, which is not evil.phyllo wrote:That can't be correct because it would prevent them from doing literally anything. They couldn't pick up a stick because it might be used to hit someone or poke out an eye. They couldn't use their hands because hands can be used to strangle someone. Feet ... kicking someone. Etc.That is not what the story says. It says they could not because they lacked the knowledge of anything that had good or evil applications. That would include procreation and sexual matters.
If Adam can use his hands without doing harm then he can use his penis without doing harm.
phyllo wrote:Yes. Why would they be ashamed of their nakedness?
God had made them naked. He had no problem with it. They had no problem with it until they ate the fruit.
It's like the fruit messed up their thinking.
The phrase in Hebrew: טוֹב וָרָע, tov wa-raʿ, literally translates as good and evil. This may be an example of the type of figure of speech known as merism, a literary device that pairs opposite terms together in order to create a general meaning, so that the phrase "good and evil" would simply imply "everything". This is seen in the Egyptian expression evil-good, which is normally employed to mean "everything". In Greek literature, Homer also uses the device when he lets Telemachus say, "I know all things, the good and the evil" (Od.20:309-10).[1]
If tree of the knowledge of good and evil is to be understood to mean a tree whose fruit imparts knowledge of everything, this phrase does not necessarily denote a moral concept. This view is held by several scholars.[1][2][3]
However, given the context of disobedience to God, other interpretations of the implications of this phrase also demand consideration. Robert Alter emphasizes the point that when God forbids the man to eat from that particular tree, he says that if he does so, he is "doomed to die". The Hebrew behind this is in a form regularly used in the Hebrew Bible for issuing death sentences.[4]
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