“Existence” is only a word. God is real without otherness.
Yeah, like I said. You abandoned logic when this started getting real for you.
You assert that god exists, but that exists doesn’t exist.
What the fuck have you even been reduced to saying here? Existence doesn’t exist!?!?! Really man?!?! And that’s your only defense of god ?!?!
Ecmandu,
The word “existence” generally means physical reality. It is circular reasoning to say only physical reality is true existence. I am not getting stuck in definitional circular logic traps.
Really?!?! You say god exists! That means spiritual reality as well!
Not all reality is physical reality requiring otherness.
Spirits are otherness. They have distinct form. Distinct form is how physical reality is defined. Otherness is always distinct form. Distinct form is always otherness. You use the word “god”. That’s distinct form. God is other than all other beings are or will ever be in existence according to you. That makes god physical reality … an otherness.
Ecmandu,
Spirits are created. God is uncaused. You cannot compare an uncaused being to caused beings. God is not a form.
My point exactly! If god is not a form, then you can’t make an argument for god.
Me, who believes god is not a form, has a great argument against god!
And what, pray tell, is this argument?
Umm… that god doesn’t have any form!
Ecmandu,
The argument for God is necessity albeit formless.
So your “good argument” against “god” is merely your idea that “god” doesn’t have a form? There are lots of things that exist that don’t have any form: any liquid, for example. Albeit everything that exists, to us, is made out of our consciousness (re: our experience of them).
Everything has a form, even a structure. Mountains move just like water except slower. Your computer moves like water too, just slower … are you going to say your computer has no form … that it’s just an illusion? Structure. Water is H2O.
No. What John is trying to say is that god has no internal and/or external. That’s the definition of a non-existent. I put him in a corner he can’t get out of and so he states something so absurd as to state “well god exists without otherness (form) - god doesn’t need an internal and/or external to exist, but then again, John also in his defense of god argument states that existence doesn’t exist.
I know with 100% certainty that existence exists and it is defined by otherness for all possible beings and that no being can destroy that truth. God cannot destroy otherness. God relies on it, necessarily to exist and because god is dependent on otherness, not the other way around, god does not have the power to destroy gods master… otherness. God cannot commit suicide and destroy otherness. Otherness is, has been and always will be greater than god.
Ecmandu,
Otherness is always quantified. It must be given a quantity to exist. There is no such thing as an uncaused quantity.
You’re spending the whole thread trying to quantify god. Absurd.
You’re spending the whole thread failing to understand that quantity cannot quantify itself.
We are quantity quantifying our selves. We have what’s called “self recursive awareness” … we know we exist. Are you saying god doesn’t know god exists?
No, we are not. We are built by quantity.
You know, sometimes it’d be nice if you quoted me in your reply so people could see how ridiculous your responses are.
You literally said to me that “quantity cannot quantify itself“. All of us do it everyday. We’re aware we exist.
There is only one existence. You can’t split it up into caused and uncaused. A caused existence implies that something caused it, but that means something existed before it, which means there was already existence before it. Either what you’re calling caused existence isn’t existence per se (but something in existence) or you’ve got an infinite regress on your hands.
Please address my point about the H2O molecule. I gave that analogy so that you’d understand where I’m coming from. Just as an H2O molecule is still water, an indivisible unit of spacetime is still spacetime. You need to explain to me how this isn’t the case for spacetime if you want to move beyond this point.