I’m interested in putting together a small but efficient online debate on the issue of theism vs atheism…
I’d like to select 5 theists and 5 atheists to form a decent philosophical debate on the issue.
Also as a referee i suppose SIATD will do because he rarely, if ever, takes sides and he’s fairily intelligent.
Now… please vote if you like the ideea.
For now i’ll be organizing the “atheist” team and i’m asking all the theists here to come up with a temporar leader (as i am aswell).
Then i’d like to see everyone who wishes to join post truthfully a little about himself in this manner:
Atheist/Theist
Age/Sex/Location
Education
Religion
Hobbies/General interests
Novice/Amateur/Proffesional in philosophy/theology
Then after a couple of days… me, or someone else will sellect the atheist top 5 and another person will sellect the top 5 theists for the debate.
The debate rules are yet to come out.
That is a great idea Carpathian. I am afraid that it would be a bit lop-sided though since it appears to me that the atheists heavily outweigh the theists in these forums. I am a theist, and will remain one until proof suggests otherwise. How would this debate occur? Would it remain in these forums or by instant messaging, and how would other people be spectators or hear about the results?
Sorry to be picky, but if you were really a theist, wouldn´t proof be irrelevent, as your believe is supposed to be based on faith? So which proof HAS led you to be a theist, and which proof could suggest otherwise?
Proof is not irrelevent to theism. Theism is based on the greatest proof of all! My theistic faith is greater (in quality) than your atheistic faith because I believe, rationally, that complex design is proclamation of an intelligent designer. All the proof I need to believe in God is to look up at the stary sky. I know that statement seems sort of silly to you highly evolved folks, but that is all the proof that is needed. The proof that I would accept that would suggest to me otherwise is outlined here:
i’m sorry… but despite what passion kept writting… there’s overwhealming proof in favour of evolution. i’m sorry; you really shouldd follow passion in these matters… he’s a lost cause.
And btw… an atheist can contemplate a starry sky… and the universe… and so on… without postulating god. And might i say its actually better.
i was somwhat tempted at first but. i’m not a very good candidate cus’
#1 i lack endurance at these dabaits which i feel are the most important of all,but seem really lacking somehow when read.
#2 i lack any credentials.
i also stand behind creation complexity, as creation as my foundation of creationism. i cant belive it all was pieced together at random.
last time i was hearing out evolutionism,they showed me 2 species, then a ‘missing link’ where the middle nostril was in the middle of the head while the ones on the right and left were a top nostril and a nose located nostril.
that ‘proof’ seemed weak somehow. they refer to microbes constantly and thier evoltionist power. i’m keenly aware of them thanks. non of the marvelous miro-power was ever put in a superioir species was it?
why? why mammals the ‘dominent’ species? insects and microbes seem mightyer. yet they stopped evolving?
the fact that lots of species are similar does not convince me of evolution.
i belive a species over years could differntiate into sub-species through dormant genetic ressecive genes coming out.also some adaptation.
(white tiger or leopords,cant remember which cat,wolves from dogs or vice versa, human culture group differenceiation,asian,negro,white,mexican)
but i dont belive a whole new species could emerge. thats pushing it.
also,Xunzian clearly stated that evolution does NOT claim to explain the origin of life. which kind of still confuses me cus some probly figure it does. what a huge gap.
i think i got my grade 11. homeschooling was hell for me. so boring. if there is no will in learning whats the point?
i am immersed in an ongoing bible-education coarse that any jehovah’s witness would be immersed in. because, in fact,it is what is taught at any of thier meetings.or through their magazines.
still,what interests me, i study.
got no awards,no credentails(except my award for outstanding achievement in the field of exellence,signed and dated by me )
no college. almost anything i wanted to learn or know can be found right here.(on the Internet) or at least at wikipedia.
It does make sense to lay it all out there, i think. To that end i am happy to introduce myself as a male theist in his 40s, living on the canadian prairies. I’m a pipefitter by choice; and hold two undergraduate degrees by curiosity, one in biological sciences and one in electrical engineering. I went to united church until i was 5 years old, then agnostic bordering on atheist; for the last dozen years or so i’ve been a real jew wannabe. Though i am a novice at philosophy, having taken only introductory courses, this Truth has been my only interest for some time now; aside from living with my wife.
Can we start out with a statement of agreed upon facts? i will grant the atheists the fact of biological evolution if you all grant the theists the fact of personal experience.
Dont grant them anything. Every step must be one that is hard-fought and agonized over. The theists have a disadvantage in numbers as it is. There is no need to exacerbate the situation by giving into atheism.
Ill be the second to introduce myself.
I am theist.
I am 18 years old. I am a guy. I am originally from Anaheim, California. (That’s the United States southwest coast about a 2-3 hour drive south of Los Angeles.)
I graduated from high school this year with honors. I have taken some college-level courses for dual credits in sr. high and college.
My religion is Christianity. However, there are a lot of things that arent very “Christian” about me.
My hobbies outside of forum discussions and debates in general are academics, consuming large quantities of food, and meeting “real” people my age that arent afraid to ask serious philosophical questions. (A desire to talk more about philosophy/important conversation has brought me here. I find that discourse with the majority of persons of my approximate age yields little evidence of their true personality.)
I believe that I can safely categorize myself as a novice philosopher. The person who inspired me the most to buck the trend was my uncle who has a doctorate in theology (and makes a living teaching theology). Many late nights spent with my uncle have instilled in me the desire to pursue truth despite opposition.
OK, so you feel content to look up at the sky and think you know everything about the universe. Isn´t that a little bit unlikely? Surely you´re blinded by the fear of not knowing, and the threat of meaninglessness to your existence?
When I and other atheists look up at the sky, we revel in the endless possibilities that could be the case; we explore with a passion the infinite ways to answer infinite questions. We admire and welcome the fact that the human brain can probably grasp only a fraction of what could really be going on out there.
Our minds are free to experience an awe that could never be equalled by those whose answers dictacte their whole view of existence…How boring, how paralysing. You have a mind - it´s a terrible shame you´re so easily willing to forgo its potential.
Giving in to the facts of the matter is not giving in to atheism.
Actually, thinking about it i realize i can only argue for accepting the possibilty that cultural expressions of spirituality are honest attempts to describe real spiritual perceptions; and because they get their message across in a manner that achieves their desired end they are in fact meaningful and true. The movement from there to my previously described spiritual position is a leap of faith.
