easy ideas, hard ideas

[iambiguous]

@Dan~

A hard idea goes something like this:
Almost any thing is possible if it has enough causal forces supporting it.
A easy idea goes like this:
Nobody / nothing matters.

Again, here’s the thing, Dan.

Or, rather, here’s the thing given my own subjective reaction to the points you make above.

Easy ideas, hard ideas, with you they are almost always encompassed in general description abstractions. Or psychologisms. At least with respect to the posts that I read from you.

What particular context in which what particular causal forces make what possible? Now, in the either/or world that can be something simple like how a screwdriver works. And then all the way up to Einstein’s theories of relativity. From objective science enabling us to create extraordinary engineering feats and technologies to the world of the very, very big and the very, very small. The parts where certainty gives way to all manner of fanciful theories.

Ah, but in the is/ought world?

Again: you choose the context, the behaviors and the conflicting good. We can then examine and explore each other’s distinctions between easy and hard.

As for your rendition of the “easy” idea from nihilists that “nobody/nothing matters”, I know just how futile it will be to explain [once again] the distinction between essential and existential meaning. Even after I do, tomorrow or next week you will be back claiming that all nihilists insist that nobody/nothing matters.

@Dan~

Another hard idea is:
Moral truth is possible, even though it is very hard to get it just right.
And an easy idea:
There is no such thing as truth.

I agree. Moral truth – objective, even universal moral truth – is certainly possible. For example all you need do is to believe in a God/the God/your God, right? You don’t even have to demonstrate that in fact He does exist…merely have faith that He does. Same with, philosophically, deontology. Or, politically, ideology. Or wrap your self-righteous arrogance as Satyr does around genes and nature.

On the other hand, with someone like me, you are going to have to bring those dogmas down to Earth, and, given particular sets of circumstances, defend those fonts when confronted with the components of my own moral philosophy.

Which, again, Dan you won’t do.

And neither will Satyr. The only difference being that over there, Satyr has for all practical purposes banned me from the discussions.

So, if you want to construe some nihilists as insisting that nobody or nothing matters, or that there are no moral truths – or no God – then in regard to those who claim that, I’m on your side. I’m a moral nihilist only because [in a free will world] “here and now” no one has been able to demonstrate to me of late that their own objective morality or their own God is the real deal.

@Dan~

Strength enjoys feeling itself when it is in action.
So, the hard ideas can be more appealing than the easy ideas.
A strong mind is more ideal than a tired old mind.

We’ll need a context of course.

[Dan1 (Dan~)]

Or wrap your self-righteous arrogance as Satyr does around genes and nature.

I try hard not to be arrogant.
Have I failed?

“Conflicting goods” doesn’t disprove anything, either.
Basically, people can disagree about stuff.
That’s all.

[iambiguous]

Dan…

At least try to see this from my own frame of mind.

I respond to your points above as follows…

@iambiguous

@Dan~

A hard idea goes something like this:
Almost any thing is possible if it has enough causal forces supporting it.
A easy idea goes like this:
Nobody / nothing matters.

Again, here’s the thing, Dan.

Or, rather, here’s the thing given my own subjective reaction to the points you make above.

Easy ideas, hard ideas, with you they are almost always encompassed in general description abstractions. Or psychologisms. At least with respect to the posts that I read from you.

What particular context in which what particular causal forces make what possible? Now, in the either/or world that can be something simple like how a screwdriver works. And then all the way up to Einstein’s theories of relativity. From objective science enabling us to create extraordinary engineering feats and technologies to the world of the very, very big and the very, very small. The parts where certainty gives way to all manner of fanciful theories.

Ah, but in the is/ought world?

Again: you choose the context, the behaviors and the conflicting good. We can then examine and explore each other’s distinctions between easy and hard.

As for your rendition of the “easy” idea from nihilists that “nobody/nothing matters”, I know just how futile it will be to explain [once again] the distinction between essential and existential meaning. Even after I do, tomorrow or next week you will be back claiming that all nihilists insist that nobody/nothing matters.

@Dan~

Another hard idea is:
Moral truth is possible, even though it is very hard to get it just right.
And an easy idea:
There is no such thing as truth.

I agree. Moral truth – objective, even universal moral truth – is certainly possible. For example all you need do is to believe in a God/the God/your God, right? You don’t even have to demonstrate that in fact He does exist…merely have faith that He does. Same with, philosophically, deontology. Or, politically, ideology. Or wrap your self-righteous arrogance as Satyr does around genes and nature.

On the other hand, with someone like me, you are going to have to bring those dogmas down to Earth, and, given particular sets of circumstances, defend those fonts when confronted with the components of my own moral philosophy.

Which, again, Dan you won’t do.

And neither will Satyr. The only difference being that over there, Satyr has for all practical purposes banned me from the discussions.

So, if you want to construe some nihilists as insisting that nobody or nothing matters, or that there are no moral truths – or no God – then in regard to those who claim that, I’m on your side. I’m a moral nihilist only because [in a free will world] “here and now” no one has been able to demonstrate to me of late that their own objective morality or their own God is the real deal.

@Dan~

Strength enjoys feeling itself when it is in action.
So, the hard ideas can be more appealing than the easy ideas.
A strong mind is more ideal than a tired old mind.

We’ll need a context of course.

And your sole response is this:

@Dan~

Or wrap your self-righteous arrogance as Satyr does around genes and nature.

I try hard not to be arrogant.
Have I failed?

“Conflicting goods” doesn’t disprove anything, either.
Basically, people can disagree about stuff.
That’s all.

But, okay, it’s all I have, right?

So, have you failed to be arrogant? Back again to subjective political prejudices rooted in dasein but, yes, from my own point of view, when you assert that…

[b]“Nihilism has more than one flavor, but it is an easy, useless idea.”

"Having a weak mind makes weak ideas more appealing.
A strong mind wants to do work, and can do work.
A weak mind cannot do much work, and dislikes work.

I believe this may be why iambigous posts the way he does.
His constitution is flabby and short sighted.

Eating psychological junk food weakens the mind.
Not using the mind also weakens it."[/b]

…it certainly comes off as arrogant to me.

Especially given the fact that you raised these points on a forum in which the Big Cheese there not only despises me but allows you to make your own critical observations of me given this “particular context”:

[b][i]Permissions in this forum:

You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum[/i][/b]

As for “conflicting goods”, sure, people can disagree about stuff. But is that all there is?

As a moral nihilist, I contend that disagreements are derived from the arguments I make in my signature threads. “I” in the is/ought world rooted in dasein.

Whereas for the objectivists of Satyr’s ilk disagreements ever and always come down to “one of us” [the rational and moral few] vs. “one of them” [the irrational and immoral many].

Only for him disagreements from others can be dealt with rather harshly. They could be sent to the dungeon. And, when that was “disappeared” from the forum, they can simply be gagged…and prohibited from defending themselves altogether.

[WendyDarling]

@Dan~

A hard idea goes something like this:
Almost any thing is possible if it has enough causal forces supporting it.
A easy idea goes like this:
Nobody / nothing matters.

Another hard idea is:
Moral truth is possible, even though it is very hard to get it just right.
And an easy idea:
There is no such thing as truth.

Strength enjoys feeling itself when it is in action.
So, the hard ideas can be more appealing than the easy ideas.
A strong mind is more ideal than a tired old mind.

I’m old-er and my mind is tired-er. Don’t you find Dan’s perspectives refreshing? I do.

[iambiguous]

@WendyDarling

I’m old-er and my mind is tired-er. Don’t you find Dan’s perspectives refreshing? I do.

We’ll need a context, of course.

[Dan1 (Dan~)]

…it certainly comes off as arrogant to me.

Well, I’m sorry about that.
You have virtues. Most people have some virtues.
I think you deserve to live and do your own thing.
But really, I think nihilism and weak ideas are not very desirable.
It’s similar to giving up : no longer valuing.

Don’t you find Dan’s perspectives refreshing? I do.

Thank you for that. Big time.

[Dan1 (Dan~)]

Easy ideas are not always a bad idea.
They are often a good idea.
However, the vice is in the miss-use.

[Sculptor]

@Dan~~

So, i had a little piece of realization recently.

“There is no truth” means you don’t need to be constantly finding the truth about things. Instead, it is futile, so a person gives up. This idea is easy to have, because it requires next to nothing. Just a feeling of skeptical attitude.

“There is much truth” means we have a lot of work to do.

Actually it is for most people that hardest pill to take. Knowing that just about everything you have been taught about life, death, god, santa, the tooth fairy, the nation state, god loves america, and all that bullshit we have invented to keep people in line is a pile of shit is very hard for people to take.

Truth is a tricky concept. It is grandolinquent. There are no ultimate truths. There are things that are the case; there are facts; there is inevitable consequences to actions. But truth seems to be far too connected with faith to be of any use whatever.

[iambiguous]

@Dan~

…it certainly comes off as arrogant to me.

Well, I’m sorry about that.
You have virtues. Most people have some virtues.
I think you deserve to live and do your own thing.
But really, I think nihilism and weak ideas are not very desirable.
It’s similar to giving up : no longer valuing.

Again, in my view, there is absolutely nothing of substance here for me to respond to. He thinks “in general” about “things” like this. And in thinking like this “overall” it allows him to anchor his Self to the comfort and the consolation of thinking “in general” and “overall” like this about “things”. He can simply “believe” that nihilism is weak and undesirable because it is similar to giving up and no longer valuing. That need be as far as it goes.

He can simply refuse to explore that with me given his own experiences in interacting with others in which his own value judgments came into conflict with theirs. He may even have succeeded in sustaining a life where that never even happens at all.

And he certainly isn’t going to compare and contrast the components of our own respective moral philosophies “given a particular context”. That’s my own “weird” way of exchanging philosophies here.

In any event, in going down his own One True Path there’s almost no chance that his own virtues will be challenged.

If I do say so myself.

[iambiguous]

@satyr

Ideas = translations and reactions to sensual input, synthesized in the brain.
In organisms with no nervous system there are no ideas, only sensations triggering reactions, cascading across the body.
An image, for example, in a sophisticated brain, e.g., primates, felines, canines all mammals etc. is an interpretation - abstraction - of sensual input, triggering automatic reactions.
Ideas can be synthesized, combined, in sophisticated minds, like homo sapient brains, into amalgamations, e.g., unicorns, satyrs, centaurs, etc. or inverted to contradict the source of the sensations.

@satyr

blah blah blah. And about, of all things, horses!

In other words, absolutely no attempt whatsoever to bring his own ideas – easy, hard, unintelligible – down out of the god awful autodidactic clouds.

How he is not utterly embarrassed to dump these ponderously obtuse examples of mental masturbation on us is way, way, way beyond me.

All I can do here is ask those who think that they do understand what any of it has to do with actual human interactions to at least make an attempt to explain to us what it has to do with their own day to day experiences.

[WendyDarling]

@iambiguous

@satyr

Ideas = translations and reactions to sensual input, synthesized in the brain.
In organisms with no nervous system there are no ideas, only sensations triggering reactions, cascading across the body.
An image, for example, in a sophisticated brain, e.g., primates, felines, canines all mammals etc. is an interpretation - abstraction - of sensual input, triggering automatic reactions.
Ideas can be synthesized, combined, in sophisticated minds, like homo sapient brains, into amalgamations, e.g., unicorns, satyrs, centaurs, etc. or inverted to contradict the source of the sensations.

@satyr

blah blah blah. And about, of all things, horses!

In other words, absolutely no attempt whatsoever to bring his own ideas – easy, hard, unintelligible – down out of the god awful autodidactic clouds.

How he is not utterly embarrassed to dump these ponderously obtuse examples of mental masturbation on us is way, way, way beyond me.

All I can do here is ask those who think that they do understand what any of it has to do with actual human interactions to at least make an attempt to explain to us what it has to do with their own day to day experiences.

Flawed logic, cart before the horse. An intelligent energy, mind, its ideas created physical bodies for it to receive more information.