k, don’t all throw fruit at me if i don’t know much about this, i’m after opinions.
what are people’s thoughts on feminism?
personally, i reckon its going a little too far in some areas. and i believe in equal rights for women, but also in the traditional female role of mother, wife, etc.
not that we shouldn’t still be able to get the jobs men have and earn as much as they do. but i don’t think more traditionally-minded women should be shunned. keeping a home and raising children should be seen as a respected job (and not glorified in bloody ricki lake by being called ‘‘home makers’’. you don’t make.)
if you want to work, fab. i know i certainly do. but it does seem rather unnatural to be against women settling down and having families. or wanting to.
I’m biased about feminism because I despise that Germaine Greer character. Not that I’ve read any of her books but from what she says on t.v. ggggggrrrrrrrr!
Apart from that I’m all for equality between the sexes - any rational person would be! What I dislike is the way that in recent years the differences between the sexes are being denied and there are a load of idiots about who argue that men and women are basically the same. Errr no they’re not and there’s nothing sexist about thinking they’re not. Women should get equal pay and equal opportunities but reverse discrimination (I think that’s what it’s called) is just as bad as old fashioned sexism.
I also tend to dislike a lot of what feminist literary critics write but that’s just it’s boring in my opinion and frequently of little relevance. But on the whole, feminism is a good thing as long as it’s not taken too far and doesn’t become male-bashing which is just as bad as woman-bashing (i’m not talking in a physical sense here).
[This message has been edited by alex (edited 15 January 2002).]
yeah, i agree about the feminist critics. bloody moany old bints. they’re an embarassment. theres nothing wrong with equal rights, equal opportunities and equal pay, but lets be honest, you don’t need to be a lesbian to value women. grrr.
clarice - “it does seem rather unnatural to be against women settling down and having families”
absolutely!! feminism (as i see it - i am by no means arguing in favour of all feminists or even the less radical ones) is not about depriving women of their traditional role. it’s just about saying - why should women be the ones to stay in the home and men be the ones to go out and work? if a woman chooses to stay at home and work there - great! but if a man chooses to stay at home and let his wife work, should we not accept his choice all the same? no scientific studies have ever shown that women are better at working in the home and men outside so i see no reason to believe it.
the problem that people who work in the home (home-makers) are under appreciated is very real but is not associated with sexual equality i think.
antihero - “you have to be a lesbian to be a feminist”
???
even germaine greer isn’t a lesbian.
alex - “there are a load of idiots about who argue that men and women are basically the same”
of course men and women are not the same. physically. but mentally is a far more difficult thing to prove. and to assume that the possible differences between the two mean that they should act differently is limiting to both sexes. much better we should act how we want regardless of what sex we are and not place expectations on other people to act “like a girl” or “like a boy”.
i don’t think that equal rights for women is at all possible. how can we be equal? we can’t even walk home at night without being scared of muggers or rapists. and these are usually men. this poses a great problem to equal rights.
also…screw feminism. who really wants equal rights anyway? women can get so far by showing a bit of breast or leg. it’s sad, but it’s the truth. i for one am not going to make life harder for myself by insisting i am treated the same way as men are. we’re not the same…how can we be treated the same way?
me = anti-feminist
and possibly very ignorant, as i am sure i will be told later this evening.
I’m not sure what walking home at night has to do with equal rights? It just so happens that rapists are most commonly men, and women are most commonly the victims. That’s a sad fact of life but not a result of sexual discrimination. You can’t say to a rapist “er, look, could you rape a guy to make the statistics fairer?”
Pankhurst and co. would turn in their graves to hear you ask “who wants equal rights?” People didn’t throw themselves infront of horses in order to hear women in the 21st century asking that question. What you are saying is you personally don’t mind taking on the traditional role of the female but what about the rest of the female population? Do they not matter? You are still making a choice to stay at home and it is the choice that feminists are wanting.
As chloe said, it does not mean all women go out to work it means women AND men have the choice to do what they please. That is equal rights. Being treated the same doesn’t mean equal rights. Of course women are treated differently because of the way society works but that does not rule out equal rights.
I’m not really pro-feminism i think its quite dull really. I started reading the female eunuch and it just strikes me as something of the past. Ok, in some places there is not total equality but these things take time, the revolution has already happened though.
okay, so maybe the walking home thing is a bit of a weak link, it was just relating to a conversation i had with a bloke earlier. basically, i was saying that women can’t be treated the same as men because we’re weaker than they are, and that was the only example i could think of.and the reason i said all the “who cares” stuff is because i get really ticked off with all the whinging women in the world pratling on about equal rights when i simply don’t think it’s do-able. besides…clarice asked for opinions…i am simply giving mine. i didn’t say anything about the rest of the female population.
as for a revolution. if you mean women becoming stronger and more powerful…doesn’t sexuality have a lot to do with that?
yeah sorry, i wasn’t trying to attack you i have a habit of being a bit fascist with my posts. When i speak of a revolution I believe that the feminist revolution has already happened and everyday equal rights is getting closer and closer so that in 10 years time there WILL be equal rights between men and women so far as that can happen.
Yes, there are physical differences between men and women and I don’t think its a bad thing for men to be masculine and women to be feminine since that is probably the way we have evolved to encourage mating etc.
So i don’t see the point of women going on about equal rights because we are moving towards them, it will just take a bit of time. Now is the time to concentrate on revolutions for equal rights which haven’t yet happened, i.e. homosexuality, race equality…
the issues which feminists have to tackle may have changed a lot in the past few years, but i think that it would be a mistake to say that the feminist revolution has already happened.
legally women may have achieved equality, and in terms of employment definately the struggle is nearly over. however, while our ideas of masculinity and femininity remain, so does the problem.
the problem in my opinion is a social one. we all see it everyday of our lives when girls are expected to be vunerable, and to look for a nice strong man to charm them and then provide them with security. and men are encouraged to find a woman who will submit to them and laugh at their jokes and admire them. ok this is a generalisation but i hope it helps me to show how differently we expect girls and boys to behave.
this problem starts in childhood when little girl baby is petted and cooed at and stroked and then given a barbie doll and expected to play mummy and be good and quiet and docile. little boy baby however has play fights and is lifted up and down to cries of “strong little jonny gonna be a boxer like his dad”. then is given an action man or a toy machine gun.
ever since birth we have been shaped according to our gender. equality is this?
As far as I can tell, a reasonable sort of feminism is the belief that women have exactly the same RIGHTS as men. So just as a man can choose to go to work or stay at home, so can a woman … much in the same way as a man could, if he wanted, bare a bit of leg or chest.
For anyone who’s saying they think feminism is pointless, furry muff, (probably less furry than a feminists), but bear in mind how fed up you’ll be when you get a job and some bloke is getting paid more than you for doing the exact same thing.
Lena… fear not. A feminist revolution could occur like the world has never seen, but we’ll still be baring a bit of chest
i reckon it could go the other way though. there will still be women doing the same jobs as men, and getting the same amount of pay (after the revolution?). so although we’ll have equal rights, most women will still choose to stay at home and raise their children. i’m a firm believer in the emotional women, logical men thing, and i think women are better at bringing up children and keeping a home than men. in general. on the other hand, i think we’re often also better at a lot of the jobs about … hang on, why do blokes exist again?
blokes exist to buy us presents and to look beautiful…well, some of them do.
but it’s not just physically that men and women are different. there are psychological differences too. for example…women don’t fall straight asleep after sex. maybe i’m just bitter.
no, life would be a bit boring without men though. maybe just keep them underground?
um…is it true that you can make a baby from two women but not from two men? i heard it somewhere, and i am not sure if this somewhere was right or not. also…do you think that’s a moral thing to do?
yeah, equal rights. good stuff. a bit unrealistic for some jobs, because men are better/women are better. but in general the opportunities should be there. where’s sarah when you need her, eh? hehe
Women are different both psychologically and physically, however we should still treat them as equals NOT as superiors. It seems to be fashionable with some women to “hate” men and to say “men are dirt” but if we do that then we are sexist.
“In the past it was ok to hate blacks, then gays, now its ok to hate men” - R.A. Wilson
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“women are different both psychologically and physically”
i love the way people come up with such rash statements and expect that by writing it down emphatically it proves it to be true. physically no one is disputing differences but i wish someone would try and explain why women should be different psychologically if it’s not just the way we’ve been taught to be.
btw this will be the last time i say this i promise. saying the same thing over and over is annoying i know!!
The full explanation of the main psychological differences between men and women would take up too much space here. but if you are interested mail me on hirendesai2000@hotmail.com and I will send you the details.
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i have a habit of being a bit fascist with my posts. When i speak of a revolution I believe that the feminist revolution has already happened and everyday equal rights is getting closer and closer so that in 10 years time there WILL be equal rights between men and women so far as that can happen.
