i want to go to heaven

but I don’t believe in heaven…but I want to go…but I don’t believe in the Christian god…

If God is the universal reclaimer of all creations, you will go regardless of what you are able to believe.

I don’t believe in the christian god

Then you get hell.

You were given free will, and two options, including the choice to disbelieve, but God was fairly assertive on this, so if you don’t believe, no heaven for you. Sucks, I didn’t make the rules, nor am I the end time Judge, but it seems a fairly slam dunk case for the prosecution.

If you don’t believe, then I dunno, hope for the best. If your just seeking the finality of receiving pleasure and want nothing to do with God, then you can do this:

foxnews.com/story/2009/02/26 … -romp.html

He went out with a bang.

Even if we had the technology to download you into a virtual world, no reason why your memories of you would constitute you, including a desire to live on in a rather pointless virtual form, lacking God. Any defect to the cloud storage your on, any computer virus could delete or mutate you. You could accidently be put in hell is the programmer is careless (Season 3 of Lexx explored this, sometimes someone from Heaven or Hell would be misplaced).

I don’t think however, its worth keeping someone who wants to continue on only for the pleasure principle, and is indecisive and opaque. Some time in hell can do someone like you a lot of good until you come out of your shell and start arriving at more conclusive… conclusions. I’ve never seen a weaker or more nebulas faith than yours. You might not believe in God, but does anyone believe in you? Are you even worthy of heaven? Heaven requires effort. Its a merit only club. You gotta know a few guys to get in, do a couple of favors, be a big man. You’ve never projected the mentality of someone worthy of heaven or hell, and purgatory was never a option. Can’t get into heaven, sucks to be you. If you don’t believe even in heaver or hell, stop trolling this section and come to the psychological section of the site, and ask what your underlining motivations are. Or, change your religion to something you can comprehend and hope God is wrong about everything, and the other religion is right.

How ridiculous.

So what do you think you will find there - lets pretend it exists.

Of course it would be ridiculous to your way of thinking.

what does believe in the Christian god mean…what are the criteria

The criteria, in order of importance to believe in the Christian God

  1. Believe in the Christian God, Self-Evident if your earnest.
  2. Don’t limit your belief to the bare minimum of effort.
  3. Don’t try to cut corners in believing when you know better.
  4. Don’t try to subject your belief to elastic, logical legalise.
  5. Make a effort to align yourself with Christian Ethics.
  6. Don’t be a shithead, and fuck youself and everyone over.
  7. Remember the Sabbath, and don’t kill the neighbors wife.

Yeah… Think that’s the seven commandants. Might of been more at some time, but I don’t know then by heart, cause they were taken down from the courtroom, so never got to memorize them from seeing them each day. I more or less nailed the gist though.

Practice one each day, and ummm… maybe you won’t go to hell, I’m guessing easily better than 50-50 chance you won’t go, but with your attitude, if you don’t change, your gonna be roasted in your turtle shell.

My points are up for debate, but not your bullshit stance. If you want in Christian heaven, and God says you gotta follow X,Y, and Z, you better follow X, Y, or Z. Its his eternal 4th of July cookout, not mine, he set the rules. Its not up for debate with me or anyone living, but you and him… and I doubt you got that much pull that you can logically entrap the creator of the universe who knows all, and make him listen otherwise to your better way of doing things. I’m betting you’ll find him far more skeptical of you than you of him, and you’ll flunk his Turing Test aim at you.

don’t you want heaven turd

I’m a Christian, not because of the benifits of Heaven, but for the same reasons I’m a philosopher. Imperatives and a Sense of Duty drives me to understand my world, and my relation to it. The imperatives come from my own impulses and introspective grasp of my own experiences, and seeing it in others. My Sense of Duty arises from those Intuitive glimpses of a better way, of asserting a virtue where vice or ignorance once was. It can be a virtue of character, a system, a idea, or invention, or simply helping someone.

I don’t need heaven as a gadfly. I wouldn’t want it if that was all there was to Christianity. I would follow Jesus even if he wasn’t God, even if the whole world spit upon his memory, and I was 100% certain he was a false messiah. Its because I see the very best of myself in him, and he carried on in impossible circumstances, against the will of a entire, cruel empire, and in the end, won. Several billion of one creed or another follow him in some way.

If you want heaven that badly, then you’ll have to earn the fruits of that paradise. A garden grown in a desert needs constant watering. I can’t give you my own proofs, as they are personal, my own. I can’t give you my imperatives either, or my awareness of impulse. Everyman has this on his own.

I recall Leo Tolstoy had a very bad shock to Nietzsche announcing God Was Dead (he knew Lou Salome, they would visit) and fell into decades of what he called Nihilism until he looked at the Russian Orthodox around him, and saw how happy they were because of their faith, and how miserable he was due to his knowledge, and realized how deeply foolish he was being, and resolved to translate the four gospels into a secular-humanist verse he could understand, distilling a kind of ethics from it acceptable to a Atheist.

His translation:


He wrote this work, and found spiritual relief.
Wittgenstein carried it in the trenches of WW1, he tried giving everyone a translation of Leo Tolstoy’s version. It was the bible that lead him to Catholicism.

I don’t think it qualifies as the needed attention whore rule the bible has that you can only get into heaven through believing in God, but Jesus wasn’t much for the rules when they conflicted with good hearted, earnest effort and seemed generally outgoing and compassionate.

I’ve never heard of someone believing in Christian Heaven while being Agnostic to God. Usually I’m convinced your trolling, but for the benefit of doubt, there ya go, one bible, designed for you. I can’t make you believe anything, nor care to force it. This isnt the bible I follow, but you seem to be struggling with the normal one, and this us customer designed for guys like you.

God gave you free will for a reason. I’m not a theologian, seek out a actual spiritual father of the denomination of your choice for more details, or join Lev for a unbeliever barbeque. Whatever… only thing I really ask of anyone is not to be a idiot or a shithead. That’s like, 3/4ths of Christianity in and of itself… Don’t be a Idiot, and Don’t be a Shithead. Lev struggles with it all.

The way to heaven is to not interfere with the plans of the Divine. This applies to turtles as well.

Here are my views. They will be labelled as religious, and scientific.

Scientific - The Process of Consciousness without Bodily Containment

Upon death, the consciousness is no longer contained in the neural net. There is no shortage of brains. What is preventing experience from jumping to one? Hypothetically, with no brains, there would be still experience, however no regulation of time. You would be a formless, timeless eternal being. In essence, you would be surrounded by infinite incoming energy, and outgoing energy both inside and outside of you, you would be an infinitely dimensional multidimensional being, but not an n-dimensional being, because you would still be in the 3 dimensional realms nor would you have any regulatory mechanisms of any kind nor n-fold access mechanisms.

Religious - The God mechan[isms] of Universal Mechanism and Intelligient Regulation

N-fold mechanisms allow it to manipulate matter and fate. It is both timeless and modular, allowing parts of [it]self to focus on and manipulate singular points. In the Christian faith, after death one will enter one if it’s constructions, the 1000 year Eden, and then enter 2nd heaven, the spiri-physical realms. The spiri-physical realms are semi physical and have plenty of light, as well as tangible communications and forms. Often described as streets paved of gold, and angelic singing, for those of the faith.

turd wouldn’t you like to live forever…not that it is possible…don’t you like the idea of immortality

The idea of an eternal turd…disgusting. Turds are flushed…I flush them every chance I get, where they can rot at the bottom of the sewer where they will fester.

Trixie, I’m Fucking Unflushable

Turtle, have absolutely no doubt, you will live longer than the universe.

Take into consideration, any aspect of yourself. It underlines a series of functions. Blinking for example, you open and close your eye.

How many eyes are on the planet right now, blinking? 7 billion human eyes, how many animals? Unknown. We’ve used in the single space of time to blink, if added together, more than the time experienable in centuries.

Farting, same.

Running, same.


A multiplex of occurance is occurring, underlining biological functions aimed at supporting and reinforcing other functions. No two people live the same life, but every life is quite generic in how deeply supported it is in this confluence of shared functions. There is no difference between a yak blinking and you blinking.

Be it presents past, or future, the universe has already outpaced the length of time possible in terms of the linear duration of the universe countless times over in living countless functions. Is there something fundamentally different from a million hypothetical alien species, or future and past humans, from doing something you do?

No. The dividing line is you don’t associate yourself with them. You rarely associate these minor functions with yourself, either. But when your life is threatened, their quality in gratifying you comes to the forefront. You wiggle your fingers, looking at them in the sunlight. You hear elements of the background noise a little better, kids playing, wind moving through the leaves.

Being may be a egoist result of a multitude of functions, and not all life parallels in creating similar creatures in diverse environments, but I rest assured a hundred million examples of me in any character, quality, or composite under this sun, and countless others have lived, are living, and will live, and my existence in time isn’t the priority. Making myself the very best I can be is.

Good deeds can shape the very fabric of time and space itself. It has a causal effect on the distribution not just of the individual, but of social relations. Of how future experiences of our various functions shall be. I can’t change the universe, but I can set to good a aspect if it, and that aspect can outstretch quantatitively any clicking click measuring time.

I am not advocating reincarnation, or a alternative to the doctrine of immortality or the soul, but really, I ask you… how many people put their shoes on in the morning? Billions? How many times have you remembered you putting on your shoe? Its memory your searching, right? You see just a handful, the rest amnesia. All those times you forgotten from the past, no different if its someone else or alien. Why do those moments belong to ‘you’? Your just as ignorant of them now as anything else anyone has forgotten.

A universal principle of the universe is forgetting. We forget, because “we” exist. How fearful do you think I am of someday not being if yesterday I’m already not? I am just as real in the past as the present, as the future.

So how can I say, in this universe where a sense of being has outweighed the sheer mass of every atom possible, where life has out experienced the sinews of matter itself, that a soul doesn’t exist, a sense of individuality, if it arises from sentience in countless yet parallel forms? I may not be able to empirically point at it, but I know its there because I have a awareness of a passing, and a sense of moving foreward. Is this heaven? Doubtful, may be radically off the mark, but I do know when the theologians talked of the difference of soul and spirit, something John Searle mocks at his podium in Berkeley, saying where in the mind is the Soul or Spirit, they were usually expressing it in a Neo-Pythagorian and Platonic light, as a aspect of a ceaselessly churning universe. I know the philosophies, but am not fit to be a theologian. Its one of countless plausible schemes of a soul, a rarification of qualities through experience some have held to, that science is loathed to attack or dismiss. Its assertable, hard to accept in all its parts, yet unnervingly hard to reject as well, as its all quite plausible. We are a countless confluence of parts. What makes us a individual is beyond my understanding in a spiritual sense, but I understand it in my imperatives and sense of duty, in pursuing good things. I can still appreciate a rainbow despite knowing its transient, and is only a optical illusion. I can see others succeed, and feel reassured myself at our shared success. I can also remember the necessity to look after myself, be humble, and be grand and exurberuant.

Makes you wonder why the universe exists as it is, a continuous threshold for sentience, consciousness. Its all we really know it to be with any certainty. So do I fear death? Somewhat, as expected. Am I afraid the Soul isn’t real, or Heaven isn’t there? These are honest questions, but better than average odds. Why? Seems the universe itself is geared towards expressing this in its every fiber. Its what our every impulse seeks to assert. You would think the mass of all creation would be heading somewhere. We are small, sentient aspects of it, but by merely scratching my balls and yawning in the mirning, I’m everywhere in it, and have surpassed its totality of duration from start to finish countless times over. A click merely measures, it is a thing to be observed relatively.

It really sucks, all that being, becoming, forgetting, and your still going to hell.

Oh well.


There are worlds or there are no worlds, heaven, Elysium, eternity, are either worlds or imaginations.

If there were a mental realm, if that was all you were experiencing, then why wouldn’t it be as real as anything else?

if consciousness continues, why wouldn’t it create [/think] a world it understands beginning with itself?

in many traditions the first image of otherworld is as an orb universe and each orb was somehow someone. we could take it that the mind would produce an image of itself, in a place it does not yet know. after that it will envision what it ‘senses’ or perceives around it. then with nothing else to divide the mental images, one experiences one another’s self representation. hence; ‘orb realms’.

so now you are building a world/universe of orbs.

you would then attempt to create a world in which those people exist. the ‘senses’ continue to deliver information about it’s surroundings and the myriad of images produced by everyone’s minds, would eventually compose similar things ~ in the same way as we make head or tails of something in this world seemingly undetermined. in other words, if there is no world, then we and all those gone before us would compose one. so now you have a made up world which is as real in your experience as this world.

now if every creature and intelligent species in the universe are doing that after physical death, then we got a rather interesting place! so what’s to stop us flying.

I want the winning power ball numbers to the state lottery also but…

You can have both Joker, if you become Serbian Orthodox:

theguardian.com/world/2015/j … ry-ball-21

I am certain now that turd and joker will be in heaven with me

I don’t care if I go to heaven or not. That’s not my incentive toward spiritual behavior.