Illegal to be homeless in Calgary, Canada

Social Forums Non-Philosophical Chat
1

It’s like a law against living. As well they get fines for panhandling & trespassing (one homeless young guy got $600 in fines in a week) The hostels are crowded & degrading & lots willl still try & find another place outside tonite even tho’ the temperature will be going down to -18F.
Seems to me that the system helps make them criminals as they are just buffeted on from place to place & some may turn to drugs in their despair.

I went on a homeless count in the big city here. I went along the river valley park system (was very tiring) We were told by the rangers that they estimated there were 140 campsites, even some families with kids. Well someone on our old forum said it’s worthwhile to talk to homeless people & I agree.

I was advised to pick one & just help him, so I see him & get him a coffee to warm up someone that I can that I kind of relate to. Shaun went to University & is somehow out on the streets now.

So I’ve been going to McDonalds for coffee & find homeless people there esp. in the early morning as they come in to warm up. Amazing how they survive, altho’ not too well, even thru’ the cold spell we had. They work for hours dragging their shopping carts (they call them their Cadillac’s) thru’ the snow to get bottles to get food. The ones I’ve met don’t use drugs or even drink much or not at all.

ct101

2

As someone who has been homeless – I’ve got to say that the amount of drug and alcohol abuse in the homeless population is sky-fucking-high.

There are undeniably a lot of people who became homeless due to unfortunate circumstances. Others became homeless because of poor choices they made.

While I think it is an unfortunate move, making homelessness illegal, I do have to say that I totally understand it.

It is worth noting that Canada has many more social programs than the US, so it is worth saying becoming homeless is also much more difficult.

When I lived in Germany, I would associate with the homeless there and they were pretty much that way by choice. While Canada doesn’t have quite the level of social programs that Germany did at the time, it is worth saying that given the safety net that countries with strong socialist tendancies is wide-as-hell.

Given that safety net, I’m not sure that it is such a bad thing, really.

3

What do you expect? Laws are determined by the property-owning classes, who have paid for that property by finding employment in the law-determining industry. Given this context, I find it remarkable that they haven’t outlawed homelessness everywhere.

Better to take out a mortgage, buy a house, spend your entire life working to give money to bankers who already have more money than God and Allah put together, and keep the property-owning classes in suede loafers and blue pool tables.

4

So what do they do to enforce it? Jail them? I think that would be a major waste of space for the real criminals. And I just wouldn’t understand charging them. It should be interesting to see the outcome though…

5

If I was homeless right now I would commit a crime! Nothing violent, just enough to get locked up. I’m a bit south of Canada, but here @ 42 degrees N. Latitude it’s -10 F tonight, and that doesn’t count windchill which brings it down to -35. As cold as that is it’s hard to comprehend how the homeless survive when it’s even colder.

No matter if it’s bad choices or what that led to being homeless, it’s a tragedy to see families with little kids trying to surive on the streets in that kind of cold. I’m no anarchist, nor do I want to topple the existing social order, but it’s preposterous that we have multibillionaires on the one hand and people sleeping under bridges in the freezing cold on the other. If civilization doesn’t work for the majority of humans, it doesn’t work period.

6

it’d be nice if everyone could have a little bit of a steez

7

I forgot to mention that the law against living is that it is illegal to sleep outside in Calgary, Canada as well as the other fines they get.

ct101

8

You’re too modest, CT101. Your question is not mundane babble. Mainly socio-political.

Here is a response from the horse’s mouth: Don’t panic. Just keep your towel. :wink:

I have lived homeless in Calgary on and off for over 3 years. I’ve been off for over a year. It’s possible I will live on the streets again. My opinion of homelessness, before experiencing it, almost completely contradicts my opinion today, after experiencing it.

There are 3 important things to remember . . .

(1) Homeless people are not simply innocent.

One of the great myths is that homeless people aren’t criminals. It’s better to say that crimes are often difficult to enforce. For example: Sexual assault. Suppose that Jack was a paedophile and committed such acts at home. Suspicions arose and Jack became confronted. Dealing with those confrontations were too painful, so Jack abandoned everything of his family. The family is disappointed, but at the same time feels uninterested in dealing with the matter further. Jack is too ignorant of the world to simply find a job and a home. So Jack becomes used to his new life on the streets. I can’t tell you how common a situation like this is. The details are always different - the name, crime, people, city, type of arrangement. The nature of the story is extremely consistent. Not necessarily sexual, not necessarily so abusive. Almost always- they did something they don’t want to face. And no one said they should. They’re receiving the consequence. They can still climb out of it.

(2) Some consistent rules make the life okay.

The people that are destroyed by life on the streets are the ones that fall in love with it. The people that do well with it are the ones that enjoy pursuing things with irrelevance to “how big” they are.

DO NOT make friends there. You live on the streets because you are struggling to deal with something. Joining someone else whom struggles with something else doesn’t let you tackle it better. It leaves you both with each other’s problems. The world is full of people you can meet. Fish where the catching is good. The streets are not jail. Lacking friends there doesn’t mean you lose bodyguards. It means you are self-reliant.

DO NOT argue with staff. State what you’re doing or what you were going to do. Don’t state expectations. Anywhere you are, there must certainly be a complaint department. If the complaint department will not listen to you, neither will the staff. If you really think you have a case, ask someone about contacting a lawyer. If you don’t think a lawyer will help: Then life’s not fair and arguing will still not help you.

(3) “Prowling” is more dangerous and more common than our parents wanted us to believe.

You need a place to sleep, a place to roam, a place to express yourself. Criminals hunt for prey using that defense. It doesn’t mean you’re the same. It means it’s difficult for police to distinguish the two. I was once walking around for hours, sober, at 2 am on a Friday. I did nothing wrong, but police interrogated me. I thought: “Gee, I’m suspicious because I’m not out to get drunk and party like everyone else at this time?” But on second thought, how was this officer supposed to know that I’m not some sort of stalker? Apparently wearing reflective apparel helps you at night- not just for safety, but to prove that you’re not trying to hide from anything.

I agree with you, CT101, that the situation is often pathetically ridiculous. Why do I see a crowd of people waiting in the cold for almost an hour for a bus ride, and behind them is a locked door to a building that’s being heated all night long? Why are drug addicts housed in the middle of the city next to crack avenue?

We’re a wasteful society. The increase of oil prices is going to nudge us toward the overhaul that we need. Urban sprawl, excessive bureaucracy, excessive marketing ploys: They’ll die as we all experience more poverty and be thankful for food.

My point is: The situation looks more dire than it is. Some people that took pity on me, I literally became angry with them (still polite). I thought: “How dare you fret over this, without even considering some kids being beat up at home because they dropped a glass of milk on the floor.”

If you are talking about Stephen avenue McDonalds, you may be interested to meet me and Marlon (usually at around 7am). That or the one by CrackMac’s on 8th street.