Is atheism a form of insanity?

Philosophy Forums Religion and Spirituality
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The atheist says - “I cannot detect God with my 5 senses, therefore he doesn’t exist”…
Is it logical to deny the existence of something simply because we can’t detect it? This essay addresses the subject -

TWIDDLING AWAY by Mick
Atheists are like a radio operator with earphones on, hunched over his radio set twiddling the knob between just 5 wavelengths (analoguous to our 5 human senses) He doesn’t know there are thousands more wavelengths out there.
In the past he’s twiddled further looking for them, but all he got was mostly static, so he gave up and stuck with his trusty old 5.
Christians on the other hand have acquired the mindset of being able to tune into wavelengths that he can’t -
“We look at things unseen rather than the seen,for the seen are temporary,but the unseen are eternal” (2 Cor 4:18 )
I had a radio once that had an “auto-search” option, it was fun putting it on “search” to automatically scan the airwaves, it locked onto a station for a few seconds, then scanned on to stop at another, and so on.
Most of the stops were crap, very faint or crackly with barely-audible foreign language coming through, it might have been Radio Timbuctoo for all i knew…
But every now and again it’d stop at a station that came through loud and clear and interesting, whether it be good music or interesting discussion in English, and i’d halt the scan and stick with it.
Likewise in real life I’ve scanned many religions in my own mind by reading about them and weighing them up, but there’s only ONE that has ever reached out and grabbed me in a vice-like grip, -Christianity :wink:

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Atheists reject God(s) because the term itself is ambiguous and arbitrary.

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Kenneth, what is the frequency?

Kropotkin

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ughh. It’s topics like this that make me sick. Is Athiesm a form of insanity? Well maybe before you IMPLY that it is you shoulf question your own mental freedom.

First off, It is not just that athiests can not “detect” your God with our senses it is also that with our MINDS (something christians are very good at throwing away) logically rationalize that it is pointless to blindly follow something with no reasonable evidence. Is it insane to put logic over speculation? HA! More like thee opposite. It isn’t about proving there ISNT a God (christian that is) it is about proving there IS. However there are so many unsolved questions and contradictions plauging that faith that the exsistence of such a God is highly unlikely. It just wouldnt make sense. If God answeres prayers (lets say from all those “faithful”) why didint he answer any of the Jews that were put to sleep by the aroma of Zyklon B in the Holocaust? Seriously. Answer that question. Oh wait, you can’t. The ignorant christian will say “God works in mysteries ways”. Bullshit. If God works in ways that a mere human ( :stuck_out_tongue: ) finds illogical than i dont want to be following him.

Einstein once sais “Condemnation without investigation is the height of ignorance”. Well having FAITH in something without INVESTIGATION(did you get that?) is an even higher peak. And almost all, (and i mean all) christians jump on the “mommy and daddy says he exists” band wagon. The bible pretty much states that predestination exsists. (revolutions?) So therefore everything we do is predetermined(according to the bible.). If everything we do is predetermined then how can one possibly be responsible for his or her fate? I.E going to hell.

It’s like this.

Your in the passenger seat of your friends vehicle. He’s driving recklessley. In fact, he’s driving so recklessley that he crashes and you both die. Thee End. The car represents your life and the driver represents God.

The bible has so many problems that it would be ridiculous for someone to actually follow christianity. You see, my thing is, i demolish one issue with the bible and then the rest just falls apart like silly putty. My Predestination tangent is an example.

Athiests are pro logic. Pro RATIONALITY. My favorite word of all time. Honestly can you christians actually say you have rationality?LMAO. How can you rationalize prayer working? Hmm? Why does God talk to some people and not others? Is that fair? No. But doesnt the bible say God is a loving a JUST God? Why would God let someone he loves be hurt? Espeially 6 million Jews. Better yet what about slavery?

The idiotic moron will say “Well if God solved your problems and didint let you experience things you wouldnt grow”. That’s a horrible argument for 1)That means he really is just playing “The Sims” with you, 2) It means he doesnt love you. Period. Any human out there will agree that if they could forsee a loved one being raped or mugged they would stop it from happening. Peiod.

Mick in England You totally distorted an athiest’s opinion with your stupid little radio metaphor. Which was pretty lame by the way. Sure, it’s comforting to a christian but logically and RATIOANLLY it doesnt make sense.

Rationality. No one. And I mean No one. Can rationalize the Holocaust with the situation that there IS a christian God. It makes it even worse that the Jews were God’s “Chosen” People. (Hmmm a loving and JUST God has a favorite?)

By the way, i say the most IGNORANT thread “Why are Atheists Nice to People”? hahahhaha I’m guessing that was from a teenage girl. On a random note i just want to say it’s threads like yours that make me sick and threads like HERS that make me LAUGH. :stuck_out_tongue:

owned.

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please explain.

and for further reference to everyone, try backing up claims you make, by making points, so others can agree or disagree and counterpoint, such is the essence of a debate/discussion. thanks

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An interesting postscript you’ve added, as though I have failed to make a ‘point’ by saying atheists find the definitions of ‘God’ ambiguous and arbitrary. Is this, or is this not, something you disagree with? What about these terms are confusing to you to the extent you would need elaboration?

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^^^I guess he wants “proof” (?) that the idea od God(s) is ambigious.

That would seem like an overkill but eh. It’s a pretty clear cut point to me.

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mick.

im guna stroll away from the topic a tad and try my best not to wander into the ad homien.

Im talking principles here not wheter or not atheism is insanity

technically you can view christianity as insanity.

if someone approached you saying they believe in or saw something without tangible third person perspective, would you believe them?

how bout if 10 people say they saw you doing somethin you know you didnt do or some event of the paranormial, would you beleive them? say the approched you with no proof would you?

how bout 100

or 1,000
or 100,000

1,000,000?

how is that any different.

with a dozen major religions everyone is saying they are right.

if you were born a muslim you’d probubly be preaching that christianity is insanity. you see where im going. what if you were born into an atheist family?

what then mick

its all subjective

what makes you any more right then them…

do you have some high authority speaking directly to you.

are we to believe that our holy father in heaven speaks to Mick in england and Mick in England spreads it to the people?

im speaking about the priniciple behind the criteria to which it appears you have made you assumptions.

you have some prety good posts at times but…most of the times a silly annalogy…

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near-death.com/atheists.html

[size=134]Atheists & scientists go to heaven.^

They don’t worship false gods. They are spiritually innocent.[/size]

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LOL Saying all atheists believe the same thing the same way is like saying all Religious people believe the same thing the same way. LOL

Expand your mind a bit more, talk to a few more atheists we all don’t feel the same way for the same reasons. LMAO Your statement was shot from the hip and not aimed real well. LOL Try asking not assuming. :laughing:

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Hi Mick,

An atheist’s mental existence is based on the premise that God, or a pervasive, orderly and perfectly reliable essence or consciousness at the heart of all things, all things being good but devolving when the conscious essence is unknown or rejected.

I propose a thread called “We are God”, and will delight in the mental squirming of atheists who read it. Even so-called religionists squirm at the idea. Why we fear that we might be God is fascinating, but exploring this fear should serve instructive – for me at least.

Yes, atheism, like pride, is a form of insanity. Spinoza’s thoughts on pride in The Ethics are worth reading. Pride, the great sin of the Bible. Call me wicked, but I enjoy the spectacle of religionists and scholars both standing firmly on their shifting sand principles, and with what I can see is indignance denying that they, we, or anyone is God. Read part of God. Hopeless are the literalists. The strong rejection of the idea that we are God is proof that that is exactly what we are.

Nice radio story, thanks. What we need is to tune into our own broadcast. It is as faint as can be, but it’s our only hope for balance. It is God talking. It’s time we let our babble subside so we can hear ourselves. Hear God within. It’s a tall order. Climbing Everest is a walk in the park compared to being an intrepid explorer within. But don’t forget to make love to your wife and girlfriend. “God doesn’t take himself seriously” either.

The atheist fears he or she might be God. They will always back themselves up against the wall in fear and trembling. We’re all so used to doing things that others approve of; taking some action, etc. In the Tao Te Ching, the sage does nothing. This is because he or she knows they are God, and all the details of life fall into place without sweat and strain or trying to impress another “philosopher”. Great wisdom is in the Beatles’ song title, “Let it Be”. We don’t realize how much. But for now, I choose to stir up the forces that demand conformity. Like U. G. Krishnamurti, I feel ready to pour gasoline on the fire.

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Nice post.

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no, I know what you mean, I’m just asking why do you think that, what evidence do you have to support it? kinda like asking theists why we think God is reasonable - same idea, just this time you’re backing up the opposite. all I’m asking is that you elaborate, not on terms, but on your logic. I personally don’t see why anyone should think that the idea of God is ambiguous and arbitrary, and that's why I’m asking you to explain. thanks.

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Powdered Water quotes in bold -
it is pointless to blindly follow something with no reasonable evidence…
Micks reply -The whole of Israel and the occupying roman army saw and heard Jesus for 3 long years, how many more eyewitnesses do you need?

If God answeres prayers (lets say from all those “faithful”) why didint he answer any of the Jews that were put to sleep by the aroma of Zyklon B in the Holocaust? …
Mick’s reply - Judaism rejects Jesus, hence their prayers go unheard by him and God. Jesus said:- “Whoever rejects me rejects God” (Luke 10:16)

everything we do is predetermined(according to the bible.). If everything we do is predetermined then how can one possibly be responsible for his or her fate? I.E going to hell.
Mick’s reply - Jesus never -ever- said to anybody “you’re going to hell”. Rather he said things like “get your act together or you’ll be in danger of hell” The conclusion - nothing is written in the stars…

The bible has so many problems that it would be ridiculous for someone to actually follow christianity.
Micks reply - be specific and i’ll clear up all your misunderstandings

Why does God talk to some people and not others?
Micks reply - He talks to NOBODY, certainly not in a voice audible by our ears. Rather, he speaks to our hearts.

what about slavery?
Micks reply - What about it? Moses killed an Egyptian foreman for mistreating a slave, and the whole book of Philemon is pleading mercy for a runaway slave.
And check this - “We also know that law is made not for the righteous but for lawbreakers and rebels, the ungodly and sinful, the unholy and irreligious; for those who kill their fathers or mothers, for murderers,for adulterers and perverts, for slave traders and liars and perjurers-and for whatever else is contrary to the sound doctrine that conforms to the glorious gospel of the blessed God” (1 Tim 1:9)

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Why are there so many Christian demoninations? Why so many religions in general? Why are there atheists at all? Why are there pantheists? Why is the ‘designer’ in Intelligent Design theory generally not refered to as ‘God’?

No ambiguity?

The bottom line is simply that if I were to ask you, right now, to define what it is we’re discussing, to define this concept of ‘God’, chances are you’re going to mention some things about ‘love’, and about ‘everything’, and about being ‘connected’, and about the necessity of ‘prime mover’ and so on and so forth. Am I wrong?

Yet, to atheists, you will not be able to define the term in a way that correlates with their worldview. Any way you attempt to describe it, there will be an excuse, or another way to word it, that will preclude them from accepting the definition.

Sometimes there’s a stalemate regarding ‘what you call God, I call the universe’ for example; but ultimately, as I said, atheists reject god because the term (or concept) is ambiguous.

Forgive me if this response leaves some holes, I’m in a bit of a rush.

Cheers.

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ok first off, you’re seeming kinda stereotypical of Christians, which I can understand, like you take what you see on TV to actually represent the whole. if I’m wrong, I apologize, it only seemed that way.

so do you want a simple definition of “God”? if so, you’re not going to find one that works. I’d like to see you define something perfect, eternal, unfathomable - it’s incredibly hard, if not impossible. to call it ambiguous is true by what most people think of today. one could ask: one or many "God"s?, benevolent or malevolent?, etc. but as much as it seems like there are a lot of denominations, the idea of God has very little to do with it. we all agree on the sovereignty and existence of the Lord Most High, Jehovah, Yahweh, God of hosts, Alpha, Omega, etc.

the things we disagree on are in terms of, say, baptism, or worship styles, or salvation. just because we disagree on those grounds doesn’t mean we have different views on God. most, if not all, of the denominations I can think of can agree on at least the existence of God and His nature.

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An atheist is a man who has no invisible means of support.
John Buchan

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This is precisely the point.

Really?

In response to my saying the concept is ambiguous and arbitrary, you’ve not hesitated to use a phrase such as ‘impossible to define’ alongside a word like ‘unfathomable’ in your attempt at refutation. Not to mention words like ‘eternal’ and ‘perfect’ which also have inherent philosophical difficulties in their own right. Think about that for a moment.

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Actually the opposite should be asked. Is it logical to believe the existence of something simply because we can’t detect it? To do this is ascertained as certain insanity. People who believe things are going on despite what there receptors tell them are often diagnosed with mental maladies. Schizophrenia, paranoia, psychosis etc. Rational thoughts can be a great thing.

Sorry this just annoys me. Timbuktuu.

Congratulations! I respect that you are a Christian so why must you insult Atheists? Does it justify your own religious standpoint? I am confused to your point besides an attack of a belief.

Let’s make a list of just a few others whom has been said to be all powerful: The commonly known Buddha, Jesus, Muhammad, Cassius Clay, Elvis. So because a person 2000 or so years ago says he is right we are to believe him? I beg to differ. Thousands of other religious zealots have come and gone in history. In time Jesus will be another one, historically he was just at the right place to create a religion which to this day somewhat oppresses Western thought.

Wow, I would want to follow this God. Your logic is “non-believer” = its ok if they suffer and die; even the children who have had no time to understand the world of themselves. That is a cruel idea for a God if you ask me.

Love the quote Phaedrus.

Now my stance on all of this. If there is a being above us he/she/it would most certainly not entertain his idea with beings such as ourselves. I find humanity thinking such is vain and selfish. I believe that as Phaedrus said that some people believe in God to simply justify themselves and their actions as righteous. I and many others have no need for this. My actions and thoughts are my own and the only things I have control of in my lifetime. I accept this to the utmost. Never do I need a powerful being to feel like I am worthy of life. If there is a God so be it. But until my mortal shell is hollow I will never know. And no one else shall either.

To claim your path is true; means you have no embrace of the Truth. To just go on the path and lead where it might means you are already there.

In closing, to dismiss others as insane and yourself superior; or your ideas is not that of a pious individual. Less preaching, more learning.

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Hell Yea, Satori owned this one. nice post.