Robert F Kennedy Jr

Philosophy Forums Society, Government, and Economics
21

K: and missing the point!

you are so focused upon your obsession, your tree, you miss the point of
the forest…to be a part of some Nazi experiment?
do you even listen to anything outside of your “tree”?

to hold “faith” in a ism or ideology, is no different then
the Christian holding to, “Jesus as savior” because it
is so beyond the facts, that only faith can redeem one…

you hold unto your faith, no different then the Christian holding
onto the bible or that “god is ultimate truth”……

you are so “sure” "hold faith"in the ism, ideology of big pharma
being the antichrist or in vaccines being evil, regardless of the
success that vaccines have had in ending the death and/or
disabilities of millions of people…

your utter faith that covid 19 is some sort of plot to
enslave America and big pharma is behind it… is nothing
more then the faith a Christian has in his god or in Jesus…
because it has no more facts then a believe in god or Jesus
has… it is true because if all one has is faith, no facts need apply…

now one may make the counter argument that Kropotkin has
“faith” “believe” in vaccines, but I have no such faith, I have
history which is vaccines has eliminated diseases and disabilities…

I can point out facts in which vaccines has reduced such diseases
as smallpox and polio and measles… I don’t need faith to
be able to present such evidence… look it up… no need to
have faith in evidence that is clearly present…

you have faith because you cannot present any type of evidence
that vaccines is some sort of “Nazi” plot to enslave America…
or to somehow deprive you of “rights”… “rights” you can’t even
clearly present to us because they DON’T exists…

“I have the right to not take vaccines”

that is fine and dandy if, if you are also
willing to die or become disable from the multitude
of diseases that vaccines prevent……

your “tree” or your ism/ideology is more important to
you then any “truth”…

why search for the truth of vaccines if you already have
the answers?

I have seen the effects of vaccines and I am a victim
of not having a vaccine…….

and all you have is your “faith” that vaccines are somehow
some sort of “Nazi plot” to control or to enslave you…

do you care to put your “faith” against “facts”?

the deaths and disability of millions due to the lack of
any sort of vaccine?

is your faith stronger then that evidence?

if your faith is stronger, congratulations,
you are a Christian…where faith is more important
then any facts…

Kropotkin

22

No one “introduces” politics into conflicts of this sort. Whenever any particular human community comes to exist there are going to be those who see things one way and those who see them another. About lots of things. Politics revolves around power. Who has the actual power to enforce one set of behaviors rather than another? Who has the power to pass legislation aimed at rewarding or punishing citizens, depending on the behaviors they choose in regard to vaccines.

Folks like Marx merely introduced the idea of “political economy”. In other words, those who own and operate the economy generally own and operate the political superstructure. The government. In America, where capitalism prevails, any number of health issues will revolve around those who own and operate the medical industrial complex. Big pharma and the like. Vaccination is no exception.

But given that America tends to encompass moderation, negotiation and compromise in its political process, there are those opposed to “the bottom line” prevailing when it comes to, say, the health and the welfare of our children.

So both sides – many sides – can be heard in regard to something like vaccines. Taking into account both the pros and the cons above such that the actual legislation itself is almost always considerably more complex and ambiguous than the dogmatic agendas preached by the extremists/objectivists at both ends of the political spectrum. It can all become nothing short of a tangled mess. But that may still be “the best of all possible worlds” when you consider that the alternatives are might makes right and right makes might.

23

You’re introducing it. That’s your particular approach to problems. It’s not my approach.

And that’s one reason that we don’t see eye to eye on a lot of issues.

The odd thing is that you don’t recognize it as one approach among several possible approaches. You respond as if it is the one and only approach.

This has been pointed out to you many times.

24

Peter, I, extremely rarely come head to head with issues with you because I think you’re mentally retarded (on a vast scale).

Someone like you believes that the electoral college means something and that voting politics (such as voter suppression) means something.

When the internet first came out in a big way in the 90’s, there was eye opening site after eye opening site from whistle blowers within and without the US government that PROVED that a branch of the CIA (all those Nazi scientists and propaganda specialists imported after the war) have been hacking US elections! The shadow government and the elites for over 30 years has used electronic vote counting machines with modems in each one (and ALL our votes are counted by machines now!!) to hack every American election since!!

You took the bait! You are so mentally retarded that you believe that the Russians interfered!

It’s the fucking United States of America that is hacking these elections dumbass, not the fucking Russians!!

America is a Nazi state (dumbass!!), and guess what? They do Nazi experiments on us!

25

K: instead of your “faith”, show me some facts…….

please show me facts that the US is hacking these elections…
show me some facts that Russia didn’t hack our elections,
we have the entire intelligence community, every single agency,
saying it was Russia that hack the 2016 election…

at every single point, you offer up faith instead of facts…

as for me being “mental retarded”, that is, once again, faith
instead of facts…… that I am smarter then you are, that is fact,
not faith…that I am not "mentally retarded is fact, not faith…

I do not have a history of mental illness, as you do, is fact, not faith…

please return when you are ready to engage in facts and not faith…

Kropotkin

26

Peter,

It’s a fact the every vote counting machine has a modem.

It’s a fact that the source code is not public domain.

It’s a fact that it’s been know since the 90’s (when the whistle blowers came forward) that the US government has known how to make votes count and also be anonymous…

The system is really simple:

You show your ID. It’s catalogued (can’t be used again). A serial number is spit out. You can then check your votes (using your ID) (at a ballot registry) against the serial number to see if it matches.

This solves every problem that people are concerned about with votes (that your boss can fire you if you don’t vote for so-and-so). Your boss cannot possible enter to see what you voted for.

And yes, you are lacking mentally. Maybe it’s just ignorance, maybe I’m being too harsh.

You are in no way shape or form smarter than me though. That I know for a fact. Some (not all) of the most brilliant people on earth have dealt with mental “issues”. Which again, shows that you’re not that smart.

27

Then we understand the meaning of “politics” differently. From my perspective whenever one person bumps into another, there is always the possibility they will want to do different things in regard to a particular set of circumstances. Like vaccines. And that can create a conflict.

Then what?

1] might makes right: One of them has the brute power to make sure that vaccination policy is in accord with their own value judgments

2] right makes might: they both agree on one rational/moral assessment of the situation and, in regard to vaccinations, behave in harmony accordingly

3] democracy and the rule of law: they moderate their points of view, negotiate a compromise and create a vaccination program such that both sides gain something and no side loses everything

Or, in a larger society, they create a legislative/executive/judicial process such that one party is able to get most or all of what they want but it is agreed that the other party might be successful in electing those who will give them most or all of what they want instead.

Or they can create a constitution and fall back on a more or less strict construction of it.

For example: thedailybeast.com/the-supre … y?ref=home

For all practical purposes, how could it be otherwise?

One way or another power always enters into it. Call it politics, call it something else.

28

You described politics but before that happens there is the apolitical evaluation of the vaccine.

29

K: as for our respective intelligence, I simply ask our readers to decide
for themselves based upon our posts…

and you still haven’t engaged in my primary points about
how big pharma is engaged in “Nazi plots”?

how do vaccinations create a “Nazi plot”?

how does a vaccination create an situation like autism
and what would be the point?

whereas we know, fact’s once again, that vaccines have
eliminated or limited such diseases like polio and smallpox
and measles and chickenpox…… diseases that killed
and disabled millions of people… fact…

your faith in the tree, the “evil” of vaccines doesn’t explain the
forest of the end of terrible killers that is smallpox and the
chickenpox and the measles, among others, found in the use of vaccines…

how do you square the circle?

Kropotkin

30

Peter, you really don’t get it.

You still believe votes in the US are actually tabulated for mayors, congressmen, senators, governors and even the president. Dude! You are so 30 years ago!

You are in denial and you don’t know shit.

31

K: I ask for facts and you give me something about me being in denial…
feel free to offer us some facts about what you say… for example, proof
that “ALL” voting machines have modems…

you point out some conspiracy about how votes are manipulated,
great, show me the evidence… to do such a manipulation requires
thousands of people to be in the loop of the conspiracy……

where is your proof that thousands of people are manipulating
our elections?

who is committing the crime?

and how does the crime go unreported given
that thousands of people are required to make
a conspiracy like this work

any facts or evidence to show us you are right?

it has nothing to do with denial and that ain’t a river
in Egypt…

show us your proof…

I know enough not to believe in some wild eye conspiracies…

Kropotkin

32

Sure, if, in any particular community, everyone can agree that only after an absolutely safe and effective vaccine has been created will an actual public policy be established.

And the odds of that?

After all, those of particular religious faiths already start out by insisting that all of this is in the hands of God.

Okay, what of their children and the state?

And, until a vaccine is created that all parents accept, what of the laws requiring children to obtain particular vaccinations before being admitted into public schools?

How on earth is it realistic to take the fact of power/politics out of this in the interim?

33

Reported? Propaganda has come a LONG way since Nazi Germany Peter!!! A really long way!! The US is a propaganda state and a Nazi state.

It’s been massively reported that

a.) yes, all vote counting machines have modems.

b.) because of what’s known about defeating this technological truth, we can conclude that the “government” doesn’t want votes to count.

Dude, Peter, you don’t know shit about voting machines, you’ve read no literature, you haven’t seen them in person and you know nothing about modems or hacking.

People who do know this shit, can’t say for 100% certain that our votes are being hacked, but they can say for 100% certain that they can be hacked.

Since the problem has already been solved and not implemented, now they can say for 100% certainty that they are being hacked.

34

Peter, let me give you a little fact about the US propaganda state.

Who won WWII?

The US?

No! It was the Russians!

Every country outside the US knows this.

35

K: and I rest my case…

Kropotkin

36

Peter,

70 million Russians died in WWII!

Only 6 million Jews

The Russian front was so brutal that the only way they didn’t starve to death was to eat their own dead! And many of them did starve to death!

You think you had some strange QED

Truth is, you don’t know what the fuck you’re talking about.

If the Americans had never entered the war, the Russians would have conquered Berlin anyways.

37

Here’s a link for you…
en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_War_II_casualties

This link states that only 27 million Russians died:

Big difference from my 70 million.

You see… hitler never expected the Russians to get involved… but fuck! Did they ever get involved!

What I’ve heard from scholars is that it was 1/3rd of the Russian population at the time.

Scholars can be wrong about the numbers.

What they all say unanimously is that had the Americans not entered the war, that Russians would have conquered Germany anyways.

38

Again, you simply insist that it has to be discussed through your perspective.

39

Anyways, we veered off a bit from the point I raised earlier. We do have whistle blowers like Kennedy but they don’t effect change.

The nazis won ww11 in the form of America from project paperclip. The propaganda ministers from Nazi germany learned a lot of lessons after the German attempt about how to control a state, give people the perception of threat, peace and freedom

Anyways… like a Nazi state, the US is experimenting massively on the US population both psychologically and physiologically.

40

Another thing about this… presidents don’t have the security clearance to know that they weren’t elected.

The global elites pick them for the DRAMA!!! The vote counting machines have been hacked by the US government for 30 years now.

It’s the biggest news story in the world!

Have you ever seen a movie or television or news snippet about this in the major papers? No!

That’s because ALL of this has to be CLEARED by the ministry of propaganda first!

Back when the internet first became public, this was a huge talking point, then the internet became controlled as well.

Back in the 90’s, the internet was the ‘Wild West’!

The ‘dark web’ was just part of the regular internet back then!

It’s all sanitized now.