The Euthyphro, Hercules and Sartre

The Euthyphro dilemma asks, basically, if God is good becaue He answers to some Good Law, and this goodness is Higher than him, and preexists Him in some way, or if instead goodness is just our word for what God declares His preference for, thus rendering goodness arbitrary. The implication (what makes it a dilemma) is that these are the only two options.
First of all, it seems to me that this assumes a law-based understanding of right and wrong. This isn’t often questioned, because I think that’s still the dominant understanding right now- an action is right (not wrong) if it doesn’t violate some rule of behavior, and ethics is a discussion about what those rules are, and how they are decided or discovered.
Consider Hercules. His story is caught up in a Hellenestic virtue/shame approach that admits to no law, and in fact, is a lesson in achieving virtue in open defiance of the same, in the form of the gods. Hercules did heroic feats, to be sure- but if you look closely at them, he wasn’t exactly righting wrongs, or rescuing damsels, or any other such things. His labors were characterized by the fact that nobody else could have possibily completed them. Indeed, their ultimate meaning was as penance for a wrong that the gods manipulated him into in the first place.
As far as I can tell, the goodness of him comes from self-exemplification, in this case through besting the labors. Accomplishing things like this is key to ‘who he is’. I don’t just mean it’s key to the plot of his story, though that is true too. What I mean is, if we could imagine Hercules from his own point of view, conquering each labor would be essential to maintaining his own self-image- of living up to his idealized notion of himself. If he failed in a labor, or balked and didn’t attempt, we could imagine This Great Hero of Greece feeling horrible shame. Not because his failure transgressed a law, or dissappointed anybody (indeed, most of the time the only people talked about who know of his labors are hoping he will fail), but rather, the shame that comes from failing one’s own standards. We see this theme repeated over and over with Greek heroes.
So, then, if Hercules is about showing himself to be indominable and superior, in the absence and defiance of external law, why do we not see him as wicked and selfish? Simply put, it is because the idea of himself that he strives to honor is something that we recognize as admirable. The man born with a great gift, beset by the capricious and arrogant Powers That Be, and using his gift to overcome the obstacles they they constantly put in front of him, is instantly respectable. We hope that in a similar position, we would behave more or less as he did- it wouldn’t make for much of a story, otherwise. It is possible that Hercules to fail in his labors, but it is not possible for him to fail and still be Hercules, in the way he strives to realize himself.
So I think here we have an example of the right and good that comes from the exemplification of one’s own respectable character. It’s a sort of virtue, defined by one’s intergrity, and recognized in a social sort of way through the appeal of the person you make yourself to be. The importance here is that we have an understanding of the good that doesn’t rely on law.
Sartre echoes this in his own way- since all free beings have an element of nothingness, we have the ability (the imperative, really) to create meaning in our own lives. Now, the impetus for him to come up with this mechanism for meaning is his conviction that meaning isn’t going to come from anywhere else, but despite that disagreement, I think there’s still something useful here for the theist to understand, in the form of a more modern exception to Euthyphro. Meaning doesn’t come from a law or else from nowhere, it comes from ourselves, and it is meaning. From Sartre’s perspective, the meaning that a man creates is in some sense arbitrary, in the way that it is completely up to us, and there is no judging as to whether or not we did a good job, other than through the reflections of society. But we don’t need to go quite that far with him. It is enough for my purposes to point out that the capacity to create meaning is tied inevitably to free will, and that free will is an irreducible facet of personhood (existing in motives, actions, and ends, but not mechanically accounted for by the interaction of them).

 So, an answer to the Euthyphro dilemma could begin with recognizing that God is free, and thus, must create meaning.  God creates meaning through His actions, the same as any other free being necessarily does.  The meaning that God creates is what we are calling good, not some higher law that God recognizes.  The meaning comes from God's unfailing ability to exemplify His own character, and it is the elements of that character that inspires us to see the meaning He creates as good, with proper understanding of it. So for example, the 10 Commandments are not themselves examples of God's goodness, but the act of giving them to the Isrealites might be.

Treating the second horn or the dilemma, God is eternal and omnipotent. Just as Hercules reacting in cowardice to his labors would be a failing of his character, there are many actions that would be failings of God’s character as well, and nothing can make God fail. So understood, what God declares to be good through His creation of meaning could not have been just anything as the dilemma asserts must be the case in the absense of higher law. God could not be or have been other than He is, and so what is good could not have been other than what it is either, even though it is based ultimately on no law. All that’s left is the inclusion of our recognition of God’s good as good, which not all people will. At the same time, we are created by this same God, so it’s natural to expect that it will resonate with the proper* expression of our own selves to do so.

  • I realize of course that Sartre would disagree that an expression of ourselves can be ‘proper’, or dictated by the circumstances of our coming to exist. However, I see that as symptomatic of his atheism, and not necessary to the points I’m trying to make here.

A thought provoking essay. God’s aseity demands that he not depend on any law external to himself. His simplicity necessitates that he cannot contain law as an element. Hercules illustrates the “goodness” of integrity. He was true to himself. God’s nature is beyond integrity–absolute simplicity.

For Christian tradition law has both negative and positive connotations. Law reflects the nature and will of God. But, love is superior to law. Moral law represents a split from our essential being. The inherent goodness of our God-created nature appears to us as an external demand. Yes it is right and good. But coming from without it is “other.” In the new being in Christ, that goodness or rightness is intrinsic “written on our hearts”. Thus, it seems true integrity should top the list of Christian virtues.

In Christ, there is no conflict between being true to oneself and being true to God. Since integrity is as close as we can come to emulating God’s simplicity, it is crucial to our calling to live as his “followers” (Ephesians 5:1).

Good essay, but I think that the all-powerful/all-knowing situation kinda short-cuts that position. After all, the glory of Hercules was that he strove and succeeded. God already knows that he will succeed and by the nature of being God, he also has to succeed. To run with the Greek example, Sarpedon makes it quite clear in the Illiad that such striving as you’ve described is meaningless to the gods because of their power and immortality. And those were eminently fallible Greek gods, so I’d see this problem as being much more difficult for the Christian God. I think this distinction remains valid in the Sartrean case – I do not think that he would view something like driving to work or taking a shower, or any other number of mundane tasks that we do without thinking or effort as “striving”. Given the attributes normally assigned to God, I am not sure that anything could really be viewed as striving in his case.

Xunzian- I’m not saying that Hercules is good because of the striving and succeeding per se. I’m saying Hercules is good because he acts in character for Hercules, and we see that character as an exemplar for something we can respect. In the case of Hercules, that character is largely defined by striving against impossible odds, true. In the case of some other figure, it might be something else. No doubt, God doesn’t strive against impossible odds. But both of them (or so I argue) gain their worthiness through a sort of self-reference and self-exemplification, and not adherence to external law. God is good through a combination of His doing the kinds of things a God would do, and us recognizing that archetype as worthy.

I can buy that, though I personally put a high premium on the notion of striving as a means of self-discovery and self-definition (whatever form it may take) which leads to a problem with respect to recognizing the archetype as worthy, which is admittedly a separate issue.

Yeah, I would agree with you that with us mortals, anyway, striving is going to be characteristic of a good person most of the time. Not necessarily because striving is a good in itself, but because most of those goods don’t come easy.

So, let me ask the more petty question: does this give a good out for the Euthyphro issue?

Yeah, I think it does. I still think that it suggests that God is limited in some way, which given discussions on “all-powerful” and “perfection” and what that means to you, that doesn’t seem to be a problem.

Correct. You need to go further. You misunderstand the implications of Sartre’s theory. Man is free precisely because God does not exist. If God existed, man could not be free, because to be free would mean to be capable of transcending the intentions of God- to do something he did not have prior knowledge of. God must have knowledge of everything…or he is not omnipotent.

Furthermore, Sartre asserts that God could not exist since to exist and have knowledge, a thing must be conscious. If it is conscious, it retains the quality of nothingness, because consciousness is never what it is conscious of.

Like human beings, God too would be a nothingness if he existed and were conscious. If God existed and was not conscious, he could not possibly have a will or the capacity for choice. You cannot get past this paradox.

With these implications in mind…you end up with a Spinozean conception of “God”…the only possible conception of “God” there is.

Well, Sartre wasn’t perfect. I do like his dissection of persons, as best I can understand it, though. What I’m really after is the way he puts the will at the center of personhood, and ties the creation of meaning to the will. If God existed, I don’t see any reason why meaning and free will can’t work basically the way he described; the omnipotence vs. free-will argument doesn’t do much for me. Indeed, I think a broadly existentialist understanding of persons undercuts it. Trying to define personal qualities like “Knowing” and “All Powerful” and “Free” is such rigorous ways that they analytically contradict each other strikes me as profoundly anti-Sartrean, even though it seems he did that very thing.
It still might be the case that there’s an intangible, mighty, and wise being who created the Universe, did all the stuff described in the Koran or whatever, including creating people with free will. No matter how we stir the words around, it still might be the case, because that’s just how Persons work.