I don’t ever talk about nondualism IRL. Only on philosophy forums. Maybe I mentioned to 2-3 people that I’m a nondualist and that it would take at least weeks or months to try to get across what that means. 
There was a lot of non-dual exploration done on my part. I went into Hindu yoga Buddhism and zem which really just kind of falls into the buddhas fundamental teachings. Buddhism is good enough for what it was originally intended to do which is relieve suffering. Getting deeper into non-dual stuff looking for more answers to the experiences or whatever takes way more concentration. Most people don’t make it past the 4 Nobel truths and may skim the 8 fold path. I’ve brought my mind (my mind lol) to an understanding that this is going to be my whole life so taking my time and being patient is what I found works best. I’m not necessarily a practitioner but I am studying it and i do meditate so if I’m labeled as that i don’t dispute it but for me i just see my self as anyone else. A seeker of understanding.
I understand it like this - reality, the path to understanding that reveals the true nature of reality. So reality is often looked at like the first symbol The taijitu is reality often looked at in dual forms but together is whole. There is more to it but that is like a summary. The 8 fold path starts with “right view.” Basically this is seeing reality without taking a single perceptive but any and all that can be applied. The right view follows the right intention and then the right speech. When these are applied to the experience the rest tend to follow without much effort. The AUM is like the end of the map not saying it’s the end of the seeking or understanding because this whole event of existence isn’t stopping. It’s always unfolding so think it as like a return to the beginning again…anyway….im sure plenty of people here are going to rip me apart for this but I have no concern of that I just ask they are respectful. I’m not telling anyone to follow my lead or you’re ignorant if you don’t behave what I’m saying. I’m just simply saying this is how i do it…that’s it. Also these aren’t the only “spiritually” associated images i have. I’ve got crosses, a lion with red yellow green (or green yellow red) color in the mane. I have some other Chinese and Japanese symbols… im not tied to anyone practice. I believe they all point to the same thing.
The boundary between our mind and of that which lies outside our mind is far more immediate (closer) than the distant molecules of the room.
For even the molecules of the brain and body that the mind senses and willfully animates, exist outside of the boundary that delineates the autonomous (and closed) inner reality of a mind.
That’s why it takes several years for a newly created mind to acclimate itself to this temporary vehicle…
…that functions as a multi-sensory “interface” between the new mind and that of the greater MIND (God) to whom that vehicle actually belongs.
So, as you look at that baby (that new mind) struggling to gain control over that highly arranged pattern of mental holography (mental imaging energy) that belongs to someone else’s mind,…
…what you are witnessing (via inference) is the presence of not only the boundary of that baby’s mind, but also the boundary of God’s mind.
Indeed, that one little body represents the presence of two distinct and separate beings.
I’m bit of an odd one out, I’m forever trying to figure out why we are here, what the purpose/reason/cause/whatever of our existence is. Why is this world here, why this particular world and not some other. Which also made me consume a huge amount of scientific and psychological knowledge. And then I started to realize that somehow everything sort of points back to itself without involving duality. Or something like that. Eventually I realized that mental content and the physical world somehow are one and the same reality without any fundamental duality involved (especially because imo QM forces us to think that the two are at least perfectly aligned). I also did a little meditation.
I discovered later that quite a few people in the East already had this kind of thinking for centuries or more. I didn’t know that a totally different way of thinking even existed on the planet.
Apparently this happens sometimes, some people who study physics, mathematics and so on sometimes discover nondual thinking on their own. Because dualism gets ruled out. Explains why so many founders of QM turned to Eastern philosophies. Now they host SAND (science and nonduality) conferences.
So for me it wasn’t really a spiritual journey, I simply figured that this is how the world works. I can pretty much disprove duality and the Western thinking, in a debate. Nondualism didn’t solve the “why are we here” either, it was just an important and unexpected side-realization to me, that made me see clearer.
Still, it would be nice to be able to tell people IRL about this huge discovery that concerns everyone, but that’s not possible in the West.
Yea man. Zen figured this out about not being able to just show people. The only way to understand it is to have the experience of it. That’s why I tend to read and practice Buddhism. I do what I can to avoid the mystical stuff because that all came way after the Buddhas fundamental teachings. Zen was a “return to the fundamentals” practice. I’ve had a couple of moments where I touched the experience through meditation and even sweeping. The funny thing is we are tapping it all the time but we don’t know it. Getting into “the flow” is another moment when we experience it. Like when you’re doing something you really love doing. You’ll notice you’ll experience a disassociation of time. I think this is also referred to as absorption…”Zoning out”… I used to call it that and I think that’s somewhat of a universal term. That’s how I know other people are experiencing this but are unaware of what they are tapping into..
I have this idea that sort of includes “god” but not the man in the clouds kind. I think about a hyper intelligence that is always here now that is not only constructing what we are experiencing but is also the experience of life and existence itself.
The ego is not outside of the experience.. what I mean is the ego, the you and I that we identify as is not outside the body nor the mind. It is a process of the body/mind. More a part of the thoughts that are part of the process of mind which itself is another process. I think it like a spiral or a nesting doll. A process in a processes in another and so on.
So how do we get this experience of being? I think it could be the senses. The hyper intelligence comes in through the senses and is then expressed out into “itself” though “our” actions/experiences utilizing the entire body/mind to do so. I’ve been trying to understand the fundamental reason it would develop agency. The only idea i could come up with was for survival. If you think about us we do something that can be found through out everything… we bond… we come together especially in dire moments and or traumatic experiences. We have relationships between 2 4 6 7 15 52 and so on… house holds, neighborhoods, communities, countries and so on… but we forget what is fundamental to our experience… this is where the agency turns against itself.. I say agency and I’m talking about the ego which is a process don’t forget… so processes turning against other processes.
think about the human body… it’s a bonding that holds it together… a solar system… a bonding… chemistry illustrates this perfectly as this is how molecules are formed.
If you think about what I said about bonding you’ll notice in this hypothesis I’m “bonding” multiple studies from a spiritual perspective to a psychological one to a scientific one together to explain my theory and not one follows the other it is all part of the experience you have simultaneously… a chaotic order or ordered chaos lol…. Anyway…. Just some shit I thought about… or something I saw form as thought to explain itself because “I” is illusory so I don’t see or think it at all lol
Can intelligence be more than just knowledge based? Yes, intelligence is far more than just knowledge-based; it is the capacity to process, understand, apply, and expand upon information, rather than simply possessing it. While knowledge constitutes the facts stored, intelligence involves using that knowledge for problem-solving, reasoning, and adapting to new, complex situations.
conventional intelligence (IQ) relates to cognitive pattern recognition, metaphysical views suggest intelligence is a divine, non-material attribute. Some philosophical perspectives consider intelligence to be a “spark of divine light” independent of the body. - per the google
Sorry, but there is only ego. But of two types, see. One is either involuntary - believes they are fulfilling some cause but are only secretly fulfilling their own desire for security and happiness (you can find these flakes everywhere on various fora) - or one is voluntary… which means they have busted all spooks and now live freely as individuals.
Interesting…. So which are you? And which am I? And you say there is only… so atoms and molecules are not a thing? The only identifiable part of reality is the ego? Please explain to me how these two egos are formed. I’m very curious
I’m still waiting… I have all day … and then some…
If I drop a brick on my foot, my ego didn’t invent the pain—the ‘bonding’ of the brick and the bone did. The senses don’t lie, even if the ego tries to tell stories about them…. But please I’d love to examine your version… still waiting.
Think about the moment that brick hits the foot. Usually, we say ‘I feel pain.’ But in that split second of impact—before the ego starts screaming—is there an ‘I’ and a ‘brick’? Or is there just a single, explosive event of experience?
The ‘brick’ and the ‘foot’ are just labels we put on the hyper-intelligence as it interacts with itself. Chemistry calls it an impact; biology calls it nerve firing; but fundamentally, it’s just the universe ‘bonding’ in a very high-energy way. The ego only shows up a second later to claim the pain and start the story of ‘Poor me, I dropped a brick.’ But the actual experience of being is found in that raw, label-less moment of impact where everything is one… anyway…. Still waiting…. And I can keep the flow of thought going while I wait or maybe I’ll just give you the time you need to respond so I’m going to go make breakfast and then when I return I hope you’ve brought your A game….
Mm-hm. ‘Things’ are just composites of force that persist because of a temporary union. For instance, your T-cells give fuck all about your liver or your upcoming birthday celebration… and yet these things benefit from the T-cell’s activity. Same with electrons. They don’t do what they do to give atoms mass… atoms have mass because they do what they do. Electrons don’t give a fuck about no atoms, bruh.
Concerning this mysterious persistence of things, we may take our lesson from Spinoza and his concept of conatus (striving for power).
You’re right, the T-cell doesn’t ‘care’ about the liver. But if the liver dies, the T-cell dies. They are biologically locked into a single process. You’re calling it ‘indifference,’ but I call it Interdependence. The fact that these ‘blind’ parts create a functioning, conscious human being who can argue about philosophy is the hyper-intelligence. It doesn’t need to ‘care’—it just needs to function as one.
If we are just like electrons and T-cells—doing things without knowing why—then ‘promethean75’ is just a byproduct of biology, not a ‘voluntary individual’ who has busted spooks. If you’re just a ‘composite of force,’ then your ego is just as ‘blind’ as an electron. So why do you claim to be free?
Let’s look at your T-cells and electrons again. You say they ‘don’t give a fuck’ and are just blind forces. But look at a Jazz musician in a deep improvisation.
The fingers don’t ‘care’ about the melody. The lungs don’t ‘care’ about the rhythm. Each part of the body is just a ‘composite of force’ doing its own mechanical thing. And yet, because they are bonded in a single process, a masterpiece emerges that none of the individual parts planned.
You call it ‘blind persistence’ (conatus), but I’m pointing to the Symphony. The ‘Hyper-intelligence’ isn’t a boss giving orders; it’s the fact that all these indifferent parts can and do harmonize into a singular experience of life.
So, if my ego is just a story told by ‘blind’ T-cells, then your ‘Voluntary Individual’ is just as much of a story. You’re still trying to be the boss of a system that you just admitted doesn’t care about you. I’m just enjoying the music.
Anyway… breakfast is ready.
I’m back… breakfast was great…. I do hope there is no offense taken in any one of my responses… I don’t think it’s possible to take something as complex as our experience of existence and or life down to a simple division of ego. I also think implying anything is free is inconsistent with reality. Nothing is free from death so implying anything lives freely seems a misrepresentation of the idea. I know we all like to believe in being free but it’s not a true statement in so many ways from political to social to eternal etc. If anyone can present an opposition that is sound I’d be willing to concede to the idea that freedom as another illusion the mind manifests is an incorrect statement.
When I talk about the ego being a “process” and freedom being an illusion, I’m really talking about what Zen calls Emptiness.
But don’t let the word fool you. In Zen, to be “empty” doesn’t mean you don’t exist; it means you are empty of a separate self. You are like a whirlpool in a river. The whirlpool is a distinct, identifiable “thing,” but it is empty of any “whirlpool-stuff” that isn’t just the river. If you stop the flow of the river, the whirlpool vanishes.
So, when we “zone out” or get into that “flow” state, we aren’t losing ourselves; we are actually dropping the “spook”(thank you for this term it’s very fun) of separation and experiencing our true nature as the river itself. We aren’t “free” from the river; we are the river. And the river doesn’t need to be free—it just needs to flow.
As someone who stumbled upon nondualism by unusual means, without spirituality, I’ll say rather disappointing things now. Just my take on things.
I can’t say that I’ve encountered any higher intelligence. Early on I did get once or twice the sensation that reality itself is somehow alive, that it’s a big being, but I think those were just new kinds of ego illusions. I think the Hindus might fall for these ones more often.
Imo there is also no additional special state, additional nondual flow-state, that one can reach, beyond the ego-death (aka nondual awakening, aka nondual realization). I think there is just this one special state. I’m however in this state 24/7 without any effort.
There is just existence, and it doesn’t feel like anything. Things just are.
I don’t think too highly of meditation practice, when it is done excessively. It’s too solitary for me, and since I don’t think we can reach more special states, I don’t really see the point of it.
I still meditate regularly, although I also often use pen and paper for it, I sort of combined it with some cognitive behavioral therapy techniques.
I also think that while detached compassion is good and important, everyday attached interpersonal love is more important.
I’ve formulated my response but it was long and I think somewhat confusing so I’ve asked the AI to reformat/rewrite it to be more palatable. Here it is-
You’re speaking my language, man. It only feels ‘special’ when you first step out of the ego lens and into that state of just being—then you realize it’s just reality. I think the Hindu traditions, later Buddhism, and even the Bible are all implying the same thing, but it’s all gotten lost in translation. Those practices are just pointing to what you’re saying: ‘Heaven’ isn’t out there or up there; it’s here and now, and it’s no different than any other experience.
I also think the misunderstanding of meditation is why people get hung up on it. People assume it requires a still, seated position with your hands in some specific way… but not at all. That’s the whole point of Zen—mindfulness during cleaning, writing, or moving. If you’re observing life without being completely consumed by it, you’re meditating. It’s just the practice of invoking a deeper sense of awareness in whatever you’re doing.
I totally agree with your last point, too. It reminds me of the nondual concept of Karma Yoga—doing the work for the sake of the work, not the result. Love your life and keep it sacred, simply because it’s the life you’re experiencing