Trump

he didn’t actually reduce taxes for working people. he reduced withholdings which gave the appearance of it in the form of bigger paychecks…but then smaller returns at the end of the year. also the plan he passed which did that actually has scheduled tax hikes for the middle class built in.

Like I thought, you get your info from the democrat agenda.

No further need to continue this exchange.

You’re asleep. Carry on.

Wendy.

The “democratic agenda” Is socialist. Always has been.

You know?

Shit like roads. Shit like public schools. Shit like Medicare. Shit like social security. Shit like pensions. Shit like worker’s compensation. All of it.

You are so far gone Wendy.

Trump is trying to destroy democracy. He’s even trying to destroy the illusion of democracy.

What feelings do you have as you insult me?

Perhaps, you are doing it wrong. Try harder, dig deeper into your well of non-emotional insults, pretty please. [-o<

(Imagine I am the Emperor Palpatine)Unleash your hate further! Lay yourself bare for all to see. Trust me, it’ll be good for you(being on the darkside!).

I don’t know. I certainly think that he tried, given the political realities that he faced. I don’t think that any president in US history ever faced the kind of hatred, lies and even outright sedition that he faced.

What I meant was merely that the agenda Trump gave voice to before the election didn’t change significantly after he was elected. Which answered my pre-election concerns that he was really just another new york globalist billionaire elitist who was simply pretending to be a man of the people.

I’ll vote for whoever appears to me to be best able to further a Trump-style agenda.

Trump was changing the orientation of the Republican party away from being the party of big Wall Street business towards being the party of the American middle and working classes who actually wield votes. While that increased its attractiveness to voters, it angered a lot of interests who represent few votes but lots of campaign contributions and armies of lobbyists. There was a whole class of ostensible Republican elitists who felt things slipping from their grasp and fought back.

I expect that many of those will be voted out of office, since their voting records don’t really reflect the wishes of any large bloc of voters. Might take a while though. So the more populist wing of the Republicans will have to find common cause with the big-business/rich-persons wing of the party when that’s possible. The Democrats are in a similar situation where their moderate and radical elected representatives have to reach some agreement. We are at an interesting stage when the divisions within the parties are at least as large as the divisions between them.

I don’t think that parties are going anywhere. Even without parties there will still be ideologies and people will group around those so as to form what amount to parties.

What we are apt to see, and might be seeing as we speak, is a great reallignment of the parties. In the early 20th century in the UK, the two big parties were the Liberal Party and the Conservative Party. Then the Labour Party appeared, stole the Liberal Party’s working class support and reduced the Liberals to minor party status. (Analogous events on the British left to what I see happening today on the US right.) In the US, the last big reallignment was right before the Civil War when the Whigs disappeared and the Republicans appeared.

Assuming of course that the US continues as a democracy, something that’s looking increasingly questionable in my opinion.

Yazata wrote

I agree.

Yazata wrote

He did (or made every effort) to follow through on all his campaign promises, uncommon in politics.

Yazata wrote

I agree.

You mean - “assuming that the US restores democracy” - meaning they have to -

  • Breakup social media monopolies
  • Enforce anti-fraud voting laws (get rid of the Dominic voting machines)
  • Prosecute criminal socialists

K; we will take from bottom to top…

Prosecute people who are socialists… according to Ob, anyone who doesn’t
follow Obser faith (and it is faith that obser engages with) anyone who doesn’t follow
oberserv faith is a criminal by definition…hence one is a criminal by lack faith
in the messiah…IQ45…one is a criminal who holds different beliefs then Observ…

two: enforcing voter fraud laws are already place and they work…this last
election every single voting expert said it was a very clean and fraud free
election… even the person IQ45 put in charge of voting (on the federal level)
said the election was clean and fraud free… and the machines you are thinking of
is dominion voting systems and they have sued every lawyer on IQ45 team including
Rudy for BILLIONS of dollars for suggesting the voting machines were
compromised in any way, shape or form…and in the discovery phase
we will be able to see just how clean these machines were… Dominion would not
have sued if they thought they might lose…

and finally social media companies, you have to make the connection between
those social media companies and democracy…

but of course you entirely missed the real actions that can help us
regain democracy… limit the power of corporations to influence/buy
politicians… it is the money that corporations have that has denied
us democracy in America… of course Oberve like all right wing
believers miss the basic facts that the problem isn’t the government…
it is corporations that own the government that is the problem…

the next step to reforming democracy is by eliminating
the massive income inequality we have in this country…
whereas 500 people own as much wealth as HALF the world does
put together… this is where democracy is having problems,
the wealthy is buying up entire governments… as the Kock
brothers have bought up a couple of state legislations,
including Wisconsin and the Dakota’s, Wyoming, and Kansas…
every single legislator in those states is bought and sold
by the Kock brothers…

you want to make democracy free… end the tyranny of money
in our democracy…

Kropotkin

Typical lying you.

I said to prosecute the criminal socialists - not all socialists (most are merely stupid). Socialists are anti-democratic and obtain their anti-democratic power largely through criminal behavior. So to restore democracy - the criminals involved in anti-democratic behavior (the socialists, unions, and monopolies - including corporate) must be countered and impugned. And no - that doesn’t mean all other criminals are to be set free (as the socialists have been doing to help obtain their power) - but it is specifically the anti-democrat criminals - the socialists - who must be prosecuted in order to restore some semblance of an actual democracy.

James S Saint used to stress the necessity of a verifying process in adding laws, to secure the intended power of the Constitution. It was a rather laborious process he had designed, but probably a good idea.

The US never had true equality, because of the way the justice system works; if you can afford an expensive lawyer you can largely keep out of jail, etc - also the principle of bail - freedom is largely bought at the justice level. Not universally so but largely.

This should really be at the core of a rational, nonMarxist socialism, the fight for equal distribution of law, but I dont think it’s even ever mentioned. Or is it? I think Marx kind of obscured these issues. Jeez, Marx. Did anyone read him here?

His argument is as follows; use value and exchange value are not linearily related, therefore neither really exists. Therefore there is only the value of labour.

:cry:

Actually. Thats what he says.