In a general reading list about Islam, this was highlighted by @ProfessorX :
Speaking of some important Islamic reading everyone should be aware of,
“Narrated `Aisha:
that the Prophet (ﷺ) married her when she was six years old and he consummated his marriage when she was nine years old. Hisham said: I have been informed that `Aisha remained with the Prophet (ﷺ) for nine years (i.e. till his death).”
Now, which is it?
Did Muhammad have sex with a 9 year old or is the text not truthful?
‘have’ 
Thanks! I corrected it
Depends on do you consider hadith reliable or not. But if we take secular historians most of them don’t consider hadith much reliable historically because they were spread through chain of narrators over centuries. And centuries duration is enough to fabricate a message through recontextualisation and all that. That’s why most secular historians don’t consider hadith much reliable.
Ok, let’s put also an answer from a secular historian.
Reference: Jonathan A. C. Brown. Muhammad: A Very Short Introduction. Oxford University Press, 2011.
Page 76:
“There is nothing more controversial to the modern reader than Muhammad’s marriage to Aisha, who is believed to have been between nine and ten years old when the marriage was consummated. (The most reliable historical sources on this marriage are the Sahih Hadith collections of al-Bukhari and Muslim (see Chapter 3)). Interestingly, no critic of Muhammad, from his fiercest opponents in the Quraysh to medieval Christian clerics, objected to his marriage to so young a wife until the modern period. This is noteworthy, since there has certainly never been a shortage of detractors seeking chinks in the armour of Muhammad’s character to exploit.”
Now, from this, we have two possibilities:
As an additional info, Muhammad during his lifetime was criticized for his marriage to Zaynab, his adopted son’s former wife.
So blaming christians now. The point is that ‘marriages’ to female children by gross men is still occurring in islamic countries and Muhammad’s marriage is used as an example to excuse it.
European royalty and aristocracy often married off small children. Those ‘pre marriages’ were not expected to be consummated for years though.
Who blamed Christians? I said something simple: if the most important accusers of Muhammad did not use it against him, either it did not happen or it was not worthy of accusation on the 7th century.
If we are referring to modern era, I know that the extreme tactics in certain Islamic countries are also criticized by other Muslims. Modern era actions, which we verify that happen, are judged with our modern standards.
It’s not ‘marriage’. In Afghanistan female children are often sold off to yukky old men. That’s child-trafficking (the real meaning of the word).
You didn’t make that clear. It’s also a stupid point. No one stood up for children back then. Treating children as people with particular rights and needs is a very recent phenomenon.
You ignore the point that it’s still happening and largely condoned in islamic countries. Iraq (post US invasion, what a ‘surprise’) changed its marriage laws to make it possible for girls to ‘marry’ at nine.
You’ve ignored everything he has said. A recurring theme with you is that:
** Caveat:
How do you conclude that I ignore it?’ I am responding to the question of this topic.
Yes, extreme bad behaviors continue to happen in certain countries. Do you want to blame all Muslims for that? Should we blame Christians for all wicked things that are happening by various denominations? Even Satanism appears only in Christian countries, should we blame Christianity for that too?
He was an attractive man, obviously. That’s why young women flocked to his island. And yeah, that’s exactly the same as old muslim men raping 6 year old children (sarcasm for those with no reading comprehension skills–i.e. pretty much everyone on here).
All l want from sunup to sundown is granny thigh gaps. I challenge anybody to show me a better way. Anything else is a crime.
Men that don’t want old are rapists.
Men MUST try old.
Men should do light stalking
Men must NOT overstep the limits when stalking.
Men that STOP stalking are PERVERTS that want YOUNG.
Men must supply attention
Men must fix roads
Men must build power stations
Men must GIMME GIMME GIMME
Entitled brat.
Is that gibberish supposed to mean something?
This is a classic example of the disgusting hypocrisy that is rampant when it comes to islam. The endless faux moral outrage, pearl-clutching, and righteous indignation over Epstein and his seedy, sleazy world of typical rich and powerful men, with barely a whisper of criticism for islam and its condoning of child rape. Hypocritical cowards.
What other people did/thought makes no difference here. If even a lot of it 7th century people did or thought something or nort, makes no difference. It’s not a question of other people’s criteria nor of standards.
@LampAndNightingale Many times people ignore what is said that if offtopic or tangential to treat others kindly and, by virtue of that, focus better on the topic at hand. The characteristics of the people that are part of a conversation makes no difference. Even a person that consumates a marriage with a 9 year old can say valid points about the topic (invalid too).
I yet have to read @VictorMcCheeseEsq blaming all muslims
Ok, if you want to ignore the second option, then we remain with only the first. Historically speaking, the fact that contemporary accusers of Muhammad did not mention this issue in their critique, weakens the possibility that it is true.
A single historical source coming only from the followers cannot be considered reliable by secular historians, it requires at least information from the opponents.
I thought the age to marry, female, was changed back to nine years and males around 12 or 13.
With females isn’t it when they reach puberty?
The age to marry in the Western world is almost obsolete as is marriage.
No one marries any more.
Paedophilia is objectively, literally, the sexual liking of pre-pubescents. It happened to me when l was 6 when l wet myself and my teacher for no discernible reason took her cue from this and thrust my face into her breasts and rubbed it around after class and l felt very strange and cold from the experience.
Now get this though: Paedophilia is actually legal in all modern nations because a fixed age of consent doesn’t guarantee puberty has occurred.
I knew a female (white, British, Christian background) who was sexually abused (one of several, sadly it’s a recurring theme in my life) when she was l think 5 or 6, by her stepfather.
Because of this or whatever reason, she only began puberty (l mean specifically, menstruating) at the age of 18. The age of consent here is 16.
I’d like to hear anybody make the case for paedophilia being impossible with a fixed age of consent.
