Was this something you had been exposed to regularly as well? Did you idolize this character or fear him? Do you believe you are this character or do you feel that this is the world and you are the opposition to it? I really just want to help manâŠ. Really
I agree, but I do not separate God and the Universe, I believe that to get to know one is to get to know the other. If the Universe sends personal signals which are ripe with deeper meaning, then those signals also come from God. Take music for example, itâs a transfer of energy that can be explained scientifically, but the beauty it contains can only come from God. I like to think that music exists everywhere on any planet with anyone who can listen to or create it, and that many songs are not unique to this planet; regional variants are being enjoyed all over the Universe. 
Can you give an example of this? What would be considered Al Ghayb? This needs some further reading on my behalf. Of course I wonât draw you further into a discussion about such a subject, just a generalisation will do.
I agree totally, and abhor sophistry in all its forms. If I ever engage in it, then it is definitely not intentional, and I would hope to be called out if that is the case.
That excludes you from at least half of the conversations on here. 
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Itâs doable but itâs usually distorted. So receivable is more like the real hurdle
Anyway⊠thanks Niall for the thread to engage in. It was a wonderful discussion and I also greatly appreciate the link to bobâs book.
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Thanks for your contributions too brother, strength to you and those you care for.
Or as Spock says.. Live long and prosper!
I donât separate God from the Universe, rather the opposite: I have the universe as a figment of his imagination. It doesnât get more personal than that. Therefore God is intimate with us always:
Qurâan 50:16 âWe verily created man and We know what his soul whispereth to him, and
We are nearer to him than his jugular vein.â
As for music, l agree with one thing: Aesthetic perception and emotions are a sign of God and cannot be explained by chemicals. They may be modulated by brain chemistry but l donât see how they can arise from brain chemistry, therefore lâd have to say they exist independenly of brain chemistry and therefore lâd have to say they exist independent of physicality and therefore lâd have to say they are of non-physical reality, and therefore lâd have to say that reality is boundless, without physical edges, borders etc. and this leads us to God.
That said though ⊠if you take CD quality 16 bit or even 24 bit audio, there are actually a finite number of 5 minute songs possible. Itâs not infinite. You can increase bit rate and song length but would that really give you new melodies beyond what 5 mins of 16 bit audio can give? Yet God is infinite. So, God is way beyond music.
- Re: Al Ghayb: Iâm unsure. The Qurâan gives a few examples, as do the hadith l think. But thereâs no strict rule. Also, some Unseen things are just unseen, rather than Unseen. For example: Jinn (spirits) may be hidden, but they sometimes reveal themselves. That said, a Jinnâs true form is unknown to us for some reason. Also, the dark side of the Moon is al Ghayb but not THE Unseen. Itâs just hidden from us by perspective and tidal locking l think?
The true Al Ghayb, Unseen with a capital U, is the Unknowable, and weâre forbidden from discussing it as itâs just undoable, and a waste of time and a vanity. For example: If l punched a brick wall in paradise, l wonât feel pain but l would surely feel something, but what? Would l travel faster than light speed in paradise? Was Satan an alien astronaut? God is discerning, thus perfectly Just. Would he therefore have a favourite colour? Would his choice of favourite colour change while heâs straining to life an unliftable object that he has made possible via a virtual reality just to experience the un-liftable?
What is the largest prime? [this may not actually be al Ghayb]
The time of my death.
The time of the day of Judgement.
The fate of the earth 1 million galactic-years after the day of Judgement
etc.
- Re: sophistry: no itâs okay l was just explaining how The Void is undoable. Not that itâs blasphemy, hurtful to my feelings or whatever. Itâs just undoable, l was further also showing how this can still be done to an extent, but only in the sense of Black Arts, and how those Black Arts are essentially worthless though. e.g. Sophistry and crappy argumentation to hypno someone into submission. So even if people try to do The Void, itâs just crappy. To me, the Void is putting my hand through a wall, but my body disappears the more l move into the wall, first fingertips, then arm, etc. Itâs just nothingness. Nothing to say. Empty, null, void.
By the way, if you look at the Neoplatonic scheme of intelligences (l think the most famous was Plotinus, but the only one lâve read to any extent was Ibn Sina, and l think also Suhrawardi the martyred one, founder of Illuminationism - not the other Suhrawardi.) youâll see how they may act to step-down the frequency of Godhead from Ain Soph (infinite actual, the Face of Allah) from inifnite frequency, to something finite.
The moment we reach finite frequency, we have visible light. The transformer used would be the First Intellect, which l think we call The Angel Gabriel / Jibreel, peace be upon him - though lâm not sure. This is all hypothetical anyway. But it gels with my idea of stepping down frequency.
- The Un-doable: So there you have it: The Unseen (the Mind of God, the quantum situation at the moment of big bang etc.) and The Void, are where l break down and fall away. I canât go there. I start to lose coherence. I vanish away. It may be that the Unseen and the Void act together in Godâs mind to space thoughts apart, who knows? Or it maybe that The Void is a pure fantasy used by created beings in a vain attempt to scare God. Iâm starting to discuss the Unseen now though hehe. Pure conjecture, worthless.
You are talking about 16 million wave samples per song. That gives 128 trillion possible combinations. But if we say that most of those wouldnât be pleasing to the ear (which they wouldnât) then we can probably reduce the number to a few trillion. There havenât been a few trillion songs written, so I think we have a lot of ground to cover there.
However, if any of that is applied to modern music, the number of combinations reduces dramatically as it is directly proportional to available imagination, so letâs just say around 500.
Maybe the largest prime is God Himself? I like your fascination with prime numbers, they describe much of what we can see and seem to be built in to the Universe as a whole.
Iâm still in my philosophy short pants, but Iâll bookmark this for later.
At least youâre not trying to define the will of the Djinn, Iâm sure God wouldnât be that upset. I just consider the void to be empty space. Every painting needs a canvas (wait, that doesnât work..). But because I believe in an infinite Universe, there is not really any place for the void without matter (or energy) in my definition.
Right. I think your Void is really just void with a small v. I think Lawrence Krauss made a gaffe about that in some book he wrote about the big bang, where he stated the universe began with nothing, but he then went onto describe that nothing as something. It had something in it. I canât recall his exact words but he was lambasted for it. I donât pay much heed to that racist coward anyway.
Back to the topic: yes l can see how The Void would be anathema to you too, for a different reason: that the universe to you is infinite.
Youâd still need to explain the white dwarf problem though, and if you say they eventually became black dwarves that then became black dwarf supernovae, thatâs all a reach, especially when zero black dwarf stars have ever been observed. Inifnite universe, infinite stars, most of them end up as white dwarves. So where are they all? Inventing a bubble for each problem (CMB, white dwarves) is too arbitrary. As for reincarnation, it erodes morality. You can kill someone and pay for it in the next life, or you know, the one after that. Also what if thereâs only 5 lives. Or 7. What if the number of lives are prime numbers dictated by your deeds. Or even numbers. One thing is certain: the ladies are gonna end up getting sooty! I mean, Suttee. Sati. The Hindu practice of widow burning. They say theyâve stopped it now. It still happens you know, and itâs not a smear campaign, itâs done so the women can be reborn as something better. I spoke with a guy who visited Amritsar and spoke with a Hindu religious teacher (as l recall, and yes l know Amritsar is mostly Sikh). He also swam in a famous river elsewhere in India, l think the Ganges. I think it was in Amritsar or somewhere else (sorry, it was long ago) he said he witnessed a widow-burning. An old lady jumped on her hubbyâs funeral pyre. He said he saw her hair catch fire etc. The police arrived too late. I remember thinking it was deliberately too late, know what l mean? They had to honour the local ways.
So, l told the guy wow: you sat with a Swami, and swam with a Sati. badum tiss. But it actually more or less happened just like that. Anyway i shall leave it there. Thank you, and please be a monotheist. Peace!
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ProselytizingâŠ.for those 70 virgins in paradise.
YesâŠmore plausible than those other conspiracies.
I need to read more about the black dwarf phenomenon, thereâs chewing gum there covering a hole, I just know it..
Otherwise, great to talk to a follower of Islam, I donât often get the chance. Hope itâs not the last time.
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Conspiracy theory #1045d: Schizomatic computer nerd is fantasising up an incest scenario but secretly he just wants granny thigh gaps galore in the afterlife. Ya love it ya.
Hahah! Yes, thereâs a lot of chewing gum filler in physics lore, we agree on that.
And peace to you too buddy! 
Sorry i had to come back and return the greeting there, rude not to.
I donât think you should have posted that though, even though he said it. Some things should not be mocked.
God existsâŠ..because cosmology proves it.
And it is written in books.
I luvs grannies.
AndâŠI am a virginâŠ.like those ladies waiting for you in paradise.
YesâŠit has something in itâŠthis nothing.
PerhapsâŠgod?
Or was it a white dwarf?
HA!!!
How convenient.
Well, that proves it then.
YesâŠ.the cosmic mind of god, imagining the universe into existence. Very original and provable.
And hereâs the proof:
Qurâan 50:16 âWe verily created man and We know what his soul whispereth to him, and
We are nearer to him than his jugular vein.â
HA!!
YesâŠcannot be explained without god.
Nonsense must be confronted with positive feedbackâŠ. humour the delusional creatureâŠ.and heâll realize the error of his ways.
Gotcha.
Emotions and music cannot be explained, the delusional man declaresâŠwithout god.
Well, that says it all, no?
In this case weâre all delusional. Weâre talking about something that canât be proven either way, so why do you consider yourself lucid and reasonable when you take a stance that is equally unprovable?
Iâm not saying that because science provides answers for both. But I like to throw God into the mix, because much of the art and beauty in the world transcends what we experience, creativity knows no bounds, and I think that it arrives from beyond, perhaps somewhere else in the Universe.
Have you never felt some sort of awakening that transcends hormones and emotions? It doesnât have to be explained by using God, but what does explain it? I think thereâs a lot more out there than we will ever know.