I have a large family of sons and daughters.
Yesterday one of my sons, now 20, came out and stated he was homosexual.
He’s a good son. Excellent scholar, hard-working and loving. He showed courage and character by telling me.
I had my suspicions for several years, but even if I had no incling, my reaction would have been the same. I love him for himself. As far as I am concerned, chemical mixes determine sexual orientation.
My parental responsibility was on how to advise him to best live his life.
I advised him against unbridled sexuality from both a moral and health perspective.
If he found love in another, be true to it and do not deceive his partner.
My final advise was the most difficult for him to understand.
I believe life is never an accident. Everyone of us have a special purpose. The central purpose for the majority is procreation and the responsible rearing of progeny.
Homosexuals have their own special purpose and I do not believe it is sodomy.
I believe it is celibacy.
Sexual energy is the most potent of all forces that drive consciousness. Mystics throughout the ages have concentrated on controling that energy for spiritual purposes. Self enlightenment has been the goal. Most of our saints were celibates
I advised him to spend a few years focusing on celibacy before he made any final decision.
Oh - so it’s okay if he’s gay as long as he doesn’t act gay? You love him for himself as long as he doesn’t act like himself.
It’s just a decision that he’s gay? How do you know this? Was it just a decision that you are straight? Did you spend a few years focusing on celibacy? Do you therefore know the benefits?
I would caution you against alienating your son. Homosexuality, by definition, is a form of sexual attraction. Your son told you that he is attracted to men, and you responded by advising him to ignore his sexuality. As well intentioned as your advise was, it could easily be interpreted as a rejection, which was probably his biggest fear in coming out.
Personally, I think that sexuality is a part of life, and many traditions recognize and embrace that. Buddhism suggests that one should embrace their sexuality in youth, and let it go later in life to pursue enlightenment. Saint Ignatius, founder of the Jesuits and actualized thinker, became celibate after years of rakishness. Sexuality cannot be everything, certainly, but it is something, and it can’t be ignored. Your son has his whole life to release his attachment to sexuality, and ultimately that may be the goal. But that’s probably impossible for him to see at this point.
If you notice, his son told him of his sexual leanings. This tells me he trusts his father’s counsel. Also as was stated, he had an idea of his son’s sexual leanings before the discussion came up. A parent who loves their child will offer their best advice (often times) according to their life’s experiences and religious affectations. If their bond is close, then the child will through time will weigh a parent’s word’s if they correlated with their family’s lifstyle. I didn’t notice any villification to MagnetMan’s post here, rather thoughtful viewpoint he decided to share with the participants of ILP. Whether or not he was looking for advice form people here, we have to be careful of the advice we give, due to the fact it could cause negative impacts on him as well.
Litenin - I have told my father many things for reasons other than to get his advice about them. Likely you have, as well. Likely everyone has.
For the record, I’m sure not giving MM any advice. I don’t usually have much luck with religious dogma.
As for MM alienating his son - sometimes that’s the best course, although I have no way of knowing that in this case. I have certainly known some parents whose children would be better off without them.
Faust, even questioning thoughts of reflection give an air of authoritative semblance. As you are aware, parents don’t have built in texts in how to raise children. We often rely on our parents for help in that direction. Even if we had felt we were dealt with unfairly during the raising of us. I was taking MagnetMan’s post as an infomative visage for our reflectional well being. If dogma was observed by the reading of his post, that too for me was a qualification of where his thoughts were in how he talked to his son in that situation.
My first response to thread wasn’t meant to be a critical observation of other’s thoughts, rather I was trying to convey that we should show temperance of thought of how we respond to topics such as these. When we are looking in a third person way, we must remove our egos from any responses.
i admire your respect and respectful approach. also your notions of purpose seem to be very fair. but i am inclined to believe that Gay’s generally don’t have a choice in their orientation. your advice about celibacy is very insightful, but as for teh decision making, you may be far too late.
You should read opening posts more carefully before you make harsh judgements. I explained three clear choices and did not insist on any. You obviously have no understanding about parental love and concern - or the wisdom it brings to us.
Read them again and have the grace to appologise.
Here we have yet another presumptive response. You too need to read the opening post again
He told me he is and also that he spent several years agonizing over it. He may well not be. Either way, my feelings will remain the same.
I have never gotten horny looking at a naked man.
One year in a Zen monastary. I year in a Cave. I year travelling the world… No sex.
Enough insight to give my son what I believe to be the best advise any father could give on homosexuality.
This is confirmed by my son himself. Who read my post and approved it. He has not read your response yet. I will be sure to let you know his opinion.
I said most, not all. Try reading some biographies.
Honestly, I don’t think the advise you gave him was bad. I know many, many homosexuals that would be happy to have a father react the way you did. I tried reading over your post and the responses several times to see what the problem was, but I just can’t see it. As far as I can tell, you didn’t condemn him. That’s really all most homosexuals want from their parents. As far as your advice, you said what you thought was correct, and at this late in his life, if he doesn’t agree with you, he’s not going to take it. Simple as that.
I would advise not trying to force apologies out of people though, it generally leads to negative sentiment.
MagnetMan, you may want to read your own OP more carefully. You didn’t say choice, you said advice. You said you “advised” him, and that it was your final “advice” that he had trouble understanding. You never used the word “choice” or “choose”, or in any way expressed that your advices were either/or suggestions. Sorry.
Koifer, I don’t find the entire reaction objectionable, and of course it’s far and away better than the average parental response. In that respect, MM deserves credit. However, when he says “Homosexuals have their own special purpose and I do not believe it is sodomy. I believe it is celibacy,” and he’s speaking to a homosexual, he’s actually saying “your purpose is celibacy.” He’s telling his son not to have the sort of sex his son wants to have. That could well be the sort of response his son was dreading.
Carleas - Thanks. I guess I was missing that point…a little subtle I suppose. Still, I hope he is supporting enough that if his son doesn’t choose celibacy, he won’t speak against it.
Script is indeed an poor form of communication, always open to endless mis-interpretation. On top of that there are persons on this forum who would call me a bigot now matter carefully I tried to explain any point of interest. Why, God alone knows. Obviously our life values differ vastly.
I have already said that my son read my OP and approved it. He saw nothing sinisiter or authoritative in it. He is fully aware that he is fully free to lead his life whatever way his heart leads him. I have every right however, as his parent, to advise him on the path that I think would bring him the most happiness. I am disgusted by promiscuous sex by him or any of my other children. He carries my name and that of generations of my ancestors. He has a deeper obligation to me and our family and them than he has to himself. The same goes for all of us, That is what family values are all about. and that is what national values are based on. Every one of my children has been raised this way, and not one of them disagrees with it. If any of you do not share these values, that is your business and I want none of it. For those youngsters who have never been advised on the spiritual option, I sincerely hope this post is of interest.
IMO this post on parenting homosexuality is the most wholesome I have ever seen.
But, MagnetMan, what does any of that have to do with homosexuality? You stated that the “special purpose” of homosexuals is “celibacy”, which seems to be making a distinction between what you expect of your son as a homosexual, and what you expect of your children generally as members of your lineage.
Well, since such a minute part of your life is actually spent engaged in an act of sex. Your advice to your son is right in line to the norm. My heartfelt good wishes to you and yours. A loving caring family can always sort out differences.
The normal human is celibate 95% of the week any way. Mayhap, controling any lusting thoughts that distract from productive life would be hard for anyone. I would challenge anyone to limit their sexual thoughts man and woman. I am not saying be celibate physically just mentally. Physical is easy, Mental provides the challenge.
Try and put yourself in a homosexual’s shoes. Especially when young and trying to reason out why you are so different, wondering if you are deformed, if god hates you etc etc. My son’s feelings about himself are very real to me. I konw he has suffred pain and indecision. Our family is spiritually orientated. All my children take human relationships in a profound way. We believe each life has Divine purpose. There is no question in my mind that my advise to him has helped him deal with himself. How he uses it is up to him. I have advised all my sons to practice celibacy until marriage. If they want to marry a virgin, so should they be. If not, then they get what they pay for. My love remains the same no matter what. My admiration however is another matter.
MM - I studied mysticism, and mystics, for a long time. You are just making stuff up. I read your post, and I know what I saw. He told you he was gay - not that it was a decision. It is you who has misread me.
So you were celibate for three years. Didn’t seem to change your mind about your sexual preferences.
So, you are saying that your son has agreed to be celibate? That he agrees that yours is the best advice?
Why don’t you just parent him like you always have? He’s the same person, but he just let you know he likes dick.
There are no spiritual purposes. Suppressing desires is the most perverse practice out of all of them. Let your son do what he wants and do it for no reason other than wanting it. He will be happy that way.
I would be terribly disappointed in a father who wanted me to be a celibate mystic because he disliked my sexual orientation.
Wow… advising to be a virgin untill the wedding night? I would say that was setting most up for failure.
It is a beautifully romantic notion… you meet your ‘true love’, you get engaged, you marry… and your wedding night is a magical experience.
Sadly the reality of this really is not common. Its a lovely notion, but for most people not realistic. Especially these days when we all tend to marry a LOT later (might have been good advice back when we were all marrying in our teens/early twenties), and its certainly good advice to not be overtly promiscuous for obvious reasons relating to STI’s and getting unwanted pregnancies. What if someone doesn’t meet their ‘true love’ untill they are in their 30’s/40’s? You then have a person who has never been touched for far too many years. We are sexual creatures, and it is healthy for us to be sexual.
I do not have children (however i’m an aunt), but i do know that often adults as well as children, will do the opposite that is asked of them. I know that some of the most religious families produce some of the most promiscuous girls i have ever known (i went to an all girls school).
I think encouraging someone not to go leaping into endless sexual conquests IS a good thing - I have gone for long periods without sex, 2yrs one time and 3yrs the other (and a 1yr stint too), and its no big deal. I don’t want to sleep with just anyone, i want there to be a connection. There is no getting away from the danger of sex these days compared to pre-aids (although back hten of course you had all the old pox’s!).
Its great though that your son came out, some people go for years, and go and get married and never come out and subsequently are just miserable.
Why do you think that homosexuals have a special purpose? why do you believe that any of us do? Why is sodomy bad? Heterosexuals do it too…
MagnetMan, I’m afraid the pearls you cast were trampled underfoot. If your intent with this thread was to effect deliberation, then this seems to be unfolding. If it was to share how a spiritual person tries to be a parent whle sharing insights with your child for others to benefit from, then the point is being missed. I wish you well with you and your family.