The Wagies And The Modern Wage Slave

Philosophy Forums Society, Government, and Economics
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Everywhere in the west we say human slavery was abolished in the 18th century, but was it really? Has slavery merely rebranded itself under a new disguise economically, culturally, or politically? Does human slavery live on in the modern western world as a whole?

For the younger crowd there is the terminology known as wagies and everybody knows that wagies are not free independent people inside of society as everybody knows wagies live their entire lives under economic financial servitude.

This thread simply poses the question, is wage slavery real in the modern west?

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It depends on how you define slavery. The late, great Dr. Walter E. Williams described slavery as confiscation of labor services. Under that definition, we are all slaves as we have a part of our property taken from us at the point of a gun.

I would define slavery as the condition where a person works without the right to dispose of his product. In other words, any confiscation of wealth or personal property. We certainly have confiscation of wealth on a global scale. So, slavery didn’t end, it just changed forms.

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@PerpetuallyCurious

Agreed, although the lowest ranking poorest paid workers it becomes much more obvious within observation.

The concept of freedom in the west is laughable, it’s clear freedom only exists for those that can afford in buying it. Freedom becomes an extension of your bank account and financial net worth.

The freedom of mankind that every man and woman is supposedly naturally born with?

Virtually non-existent everywhere. :clown_face:

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I couldn’t agree with you more. Today, freedom means rich enough and powerful enough to ignore the rules imposed on everyone else. The United States no longer has the right to call itself the land of the free and the home of the brave.

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@PerpetuallyCurious

You will find that since 2001 at the very latest we’re a Zionist oligarchical corporate fascist militarized police state with the illusion of democracy where all the political candidates are bought and paid for before voting ever takes place.

Americanism is a simulative reality controlled by the very worst of fascists that wage psychological warfare operations constantly on the general domestic population.

:clown_face:

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If you don’t care about animals its just a lowering of humanity and the overton window. The threshold of empathy is low. And therefore people are less likely to care about humans as humans are just another type of animal.

Its like, when Israelis bombing children becomes normalized, the standards of civilization become that much lower, because they lowered the overton window.

Societies with a high overton window would have more human rights, obviously.

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That’s not what you get em with because you don’t HAVE to work… so it’s not slavery.

How you get em is like this: if i refuse to work and have no money for food, housing, or property of any sort, you will try to arrest me for stealing, hunting, trespassing or loitering.

Now everything was cool until now. NOW you, the State, are a bonafide threat to me and my well-being, and as such, i declare war on you first.

You will not find a man or god anywhere in the universe that can beat my argument. Literally, the whole of civilization collapses around this argument. Your right to exact violence upon the State to protect yourself is your very first and unconditional right.

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But this is all that history has ever been. What i just said up there would be philosophically unheard of for the bourgeoisie. It would sound like something a lunatic would say. “A war against the State… my goodness, what is that poor fellow’s problem? Have you ever heard of such a thing, Mr. Hastings? Someone ought to call the police on that man.”

But it’s REAL, bro. Real shit that happens to the working classes of the world. The wealthy can’t have this philosophy because they can’t find themselves in circumstances that produce it. They may have a vague notion of “what it would be like” and sympathize even with the poor fellow… but they couldn’t ever accept the argument because the State is theirs, and they’d not want to lose it.

Where’s the dipshit here that once said classes don’t exist, and that’s just shit the communists made up? Didn’t i hear one of you say that once?

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No, you get em with Sisyphus analogies.

Your example is flawed. I could argue that the State is righteous for imposing hunting limits, due to an overpopulation of 8 billion humans. Even though I dislike that my natural right to hunt is taken away which upsets me.

And also a wagecuck is just going to say that “well its your fault for not working, you should work then”. The only way to defeat the wagecuck would then say that you applied for an absurdly high volume of jobs (such as 100 jobs) and were rejected.

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Lol, as if a State that favors a deer’s life over my own and the opinion of a wagecuck does anything to my argument.

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@promethean75

I know you’re an an anarchist where everything wrong with the world is the state existing through your perception, but as a statist myself I would argue we have the wrong kind of state where under better conditions of a completely different kind of state altogether we could fix a variety of things through organization.

The difference between you and me is I want a completely new different kind of state where you anarchists want to disband all states entirely. I feel like this desire by anarchists is wishy washy.

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@promethean75

Where you want to abolish and destroy the state in war I on other hand want revolutionary political reform along with a complete existential transformation. I want a better future state from the ground up that truly is a voice for the majority of people.

:clown_face:

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Speaking of hunting when i was a young lad (11ish), i used to have sirius problems with deer hunting. Loved dove, quail, and turkey hunting (never got into rabbit or squirrel) but didn’t like the idea of shooting a big mammal. It was unfair to my 11 year old mind… these high-tech deer hunters up in blinded deerstands with laser scopes and compasses and all that shit. Even after i killed my first deer, i still didn’t like doing it, and every time the old man and i went hunting, i would fantasize about hunting the deer hunters.

Mm-hm… red flag. This is one of those young sociopaths who’s constructing a violent fantasy world because his old man is an asshole. Better keep an eye on that kid.

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Buddy, you can have whatever kind of State you want but if the sonsabitches don’t expunge my charges and wipe my record, I’ll go to war those cocksuckers too.

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You can choose to be a 5 year old with eyes half closed and half assed arguments and make-believe pretend arguments or you can acknowledge the reality that humans have a population of 8 billion, if everyone hunted as much meat as they please then most animal species would quickly go extinct and humans along with them,

or you can construct make-believe arguments strawmen about 1 deer and not mention how American turkey almost went extinct from overhunting when the American human population was much less.

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it may be my destiny to hear you out on this, because i encountered a guy who was a sex offender and i overheard him complaining about how his whole life is ruined over something he did 40 years ago

you already did your time yet you are punished for life for a crime, it feels excessive

its very unchristian, the Bible taught us that god intended humans to be nude, hatred of nudity is of the demonic ego. jesus taught us to forgive the sinner. modern christians are not of christ

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Well, here’s the thing. You CAN get a group of people together and have them all agree that if x then y (someone see pee-pee = lifetime Gestapo surveillance) and enforce that as a law. That’s intersubjective ethics at work, and there’s no other way to do it, really. Nobody knows what Good and Bad are for sure, but they don’t need to, to make rules.

But what doesn’t fly is when that group doesn’t follow their own rules (the statutory law they created and agreed to enforce) and criminalizes someone in that group as a result of that negligence… purposeful or not.

If that happens, all bets are off. All contracts are void. There is no recognition of ‘rights’ anymore.

This is something only a philosopher can understand. Men of the State, their courts, their law makers, and their POleece can’t fathom this, and if it ever crossed their mind, they would have a meltdown and a crisis of conscience. Even the citizen - because he is an obedient taxpayer who would cooperate with the law - is guilty by association and party to this kind of injustice.

'Course i ain’t sayin a sex offender who WAS guilty of his charges and 50 years later he’s still on a registry can’t be angry. Sure, he can. But he won’t have the sophisticated philosophical force, the edge, that a wrongfully charged man would have in such circumstances.

Not until this century has an experimental law ever been such a useless blunder and such an utter waste of money and resources. Even after the data shows that the SORNA act is empirically ineffective… even after the data shows that the SORNA act may actually CONTRIBUTE to causing sexual crimes the stupid motherfuckers keep it going.

So now you’ve got the possibility of charging a guy with sex crimes he didn’t commit and putting him on a totally ineffective registry for the rest of his life.

I look at this spectacle of man’s, and i can only grasp something this absurd as an artist would. What would make it better, richer, worthy of history. What could we add to this irreducibly absurd tragedy to make it even more beautiful.

The guy becomes a serial killing hottie raping cop killa, wastes like a hundred people, let’s himself get arrested, destroys everyone in the court room and then becomes a prisoner celebrity kept like Lecter in a special cell where he does interviews for international audiences that can’t get to sleep at night after hearing this guy. Jesus christ, have you read the book? I’m like ONLY a hundred people?! This guy was a saint! Hell the fuckers are still tryna kill em… that’s why they keep em in that cell.

There’d be a scene i’d have arranged to be shot by one of the interview crews. Silence of the Lambs type shit. Dark room. Prom’s wheeled in on a dolly in a straightjacket with a mask on. He lunges forward, but the chains snap tight and hold him back, etc.

Toward the end of the interview, Prom is asked what happened… what started this whole thing… what was the crime that sent Prom over the edge. He turns his head in a mock gesture of refusal as if the question is too difficult to answer. He doesn’t want to relive that terrible time. “No… it’s… it’s not something i can talk about.” The interviewer gives him a moment to recover and assures him that it’s in the past now and that it’s okay… that he needs to help the world understand how a man becomes such a monster, etc.

Prom hesitates and exhales slowly. He rubs his forehead with a cuffed hand and peers over at the interviewer. All this for dramatic effect.

“Allegedly, some kid saw my dick 54 years ago when i was at a mall” and then he bursts out laughing like an insane man.

Now tell me that wouldn’t be the ultimate true crime story.

See but I’d only get the small fish interviewers, none of the big brains. I’d obviously issue interview offers to the big names but they’d all avoid me because they’d get eaten.

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@promethean75

If it makes you feel any better, once this nation collapses like I am always talking about that means its legislation and laws are no longer enforced where the cruel inflicting punishment hanging over you should end as well.

Just make sure you don’t get into any trouble once the new regime is established assuming we don’t face complete total annihilation throughout the whole process. These modern nation state and civilization collapses are going to be a lot more violent or destructive than our ancient historical predecessors.

That we do share in common though, I absolutely despise and detest hypocrites where this nation of ours is full to the brim with them being virtually everywhere.

:clown_face:

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At least people don’t call it slavery. Then it’s not slavery. I mean right?

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@Starfire87

Sure, just like denialism is a thing.

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