Because we suffer.
Dissecting ourselves is what makes us suffer. Seeing ourselves as being in unity with ourselves is what makes us whole - yes?
Yes and no.
Whatever can be divided is or will be. Wishing, hoping and praying won’t put Humpty back together again.
In Vedantic terminology Self with a capital S is Consciousness. The self with a lower case s is the separate self or ego. The ego only appears as an object of consciousness. (Or then how could we ever become aware of ‘cosmic conscience ?)
…
S and s may disposition as to exchange roles, where S transforms into S, as S to s.
How could That be possibly conceivable to be certain?
Answer: (probable) 
Without such reconversion, sentience could not be ascertained by a sudden decompression.
When the dreamer wakes up they may realize that the entire dream and everything in it was themselves. Likewise, when the Self awakes, it realizes that it was the ego, its world and everything in it.
.is there a difference where woken and asleep states that do make a difference ? how else could it be written: of that difference between wakefulness and asleep in the ‘Dream Argument’ ‘between Zhuangsi and Descartes ?
If there is little or no difference, then it becomes a mute question to even inquire.
Consciousness is the same in all states. The contents of consciousness apparently differ
True, yet states of consciousness conform to the content , as differering perceptions through it may affect each other.
For in my case, pressed to the limit of both recollection through dream states, and recognition through woken state, make a huge difference.
That is, the dream which consists of an audio message does not correspond to either a visual or/and an auditory wakeful hallucination.
If they would indicate an analogical near absolute identity, then I could be committed.
But since such occurrences do happen albeit very rarely, then a hidden messianic complex could manifest in a woken state. That said, and never believing myself to be some kind of messianic figure, is key to the solution that eastern gurus recommended as cautionary preparation before engaging cosmic powers.
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“Consciousness is the same in all states. The contents of consciousness apparently differ”
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It comes down to the difference in states between consciousness in general and consciousness of self, where boundaries are critical at apprehended borders. The phenomenon of both types of states .
“Consciousness is the same in all states. The contents of consciousness apparently differ”
And in another state, such critical boundaries much reach a finely tuned limit, where the differences between content can differ from a general form of consciousness .
Just a thought
Arc,
Yes. I mean reality. Not merely the status quo.
I don’t mean you have to be omniscient or you’ll go mad.
More like, if you know all information/data, but you are not anchored to self=other love… you don’t know JACK!
Reality is going to eff you up!
The consciousness that you are is not attached to the stream of perceptions, thoughts, images that pass through it. Let them come and let them go.
If you are saying we are not our thoughts, that is true. We are the chooser/shaper of our thoughts. They are like our environment. Just like our body. That’s why it is possible to have cognitive distortions, and when there is a flood of them like a fire hose, it doesn’t matter how strong you are. You can’t do it alone. Even the strongest weightlifter needs a spotter, and should not carry more than he can.
Kind of like MagsJ on leg day.
Ecclesiastes 4:12.
Set a timer and choose to stop thinking for five minutes.
I legit don’t have a problem doing that. Are you mocking me?
Don’t answer that.
I don’t believe you. I think if you tried that you’d find out that you’re not the chooser/shaper of your thoughts.
I do that every time I need a power nap. Sometimes it doesn’t work. Usually results in hilarious thoughts or sudden insights. Sometimes it results in crap I don’t want to think about and I have to distract myself. Thoughts are like weeds or flowers or vegetables or whatever may grow in a garden. We are like a gardener. You can use applied behavioral analysis on yourself, and cognitive emotive behavioral therapy. Or you can let your garden go to crap if you have too many things going on or too many excuses.
And sometimes a black widow shows up in your garden and you have to spray with freaking spider spray. Or your garden lights on fire and you don’t have a big enough freaking fire extinguisher or freaking body of water to put it out. So you just cover it in cement with something to knock you out so you can sleep for a while.
There are healthier regular maintenance ways to handle things. Like fasting (your five minute alarm clock nonthinking thingy is that sort of thing—I usually need longer than five, but sometimes I only have five). Prayer and meditation. Reading wholesome material. Sometimes when not thinking doesn’t re-tune, wholesome material does. Instrumental classical music is a happy medium when you have information overload.
Believe me or not.
That’s more believable than your previous answer. I don’t see how one could choose one’s thoughts. I can reject a thought after it occurs. But, thoughts ordinarily come spontaneously. Thinking is natural. What, then, is meditation?
The thoughts that come spontaneously (which I said aren’t you) are like your body (which is not you - it’s just yours… well… in your charge). The thoughts you choose to think because your will is (you are) accessing your memory and thinking of (& pruning) different possibilities, or you have a sudden insight that just connects dots or synthesizes implied ones … and you don’t prune them but concur with them (pruning & removing concurrence from everything in conflict with it) … that’s you. Of course you can also just sit with them if you are not convinced toward one conclusion because maybe there is equal “weight” on dots supporting the currently connected possible conclusions — with gaps (questions) that need to be filled before a decision/concurrence can be made—forsaking all others.
Yes. This shows great progress over what you said before. You are not your body nor your thoughts. As an individual you identify with the intellect which is the ability to make decisions by weighing the pros and cons of a situation and discriminating between opposites and to control the emotion.
Do you know what’s goofy about you and very egoistic? You will only acknowledge something is progress if it looks like backpedaling and admitting you were right and they were wrong.
I didn’t even read past that word progress yet. So here… this is what you want: Felix dakat, you are right in every imaginable way possible, and I am wrong in every imaginable way possible, and you are far superior to me in intellect and in everything else it is possible to be superior. Congratulations. Now what?
I will admit it is progress if you can show me how I have not been saying that this entire time I’ve been on this board. Show me one thing I have said which conflicted with it.
Actually I could probably say it a little better than that.
I am sorry …now I sound like the ass.
Okay. It wasn’t progress then. You merely clarified your thinking about thoughts for me. Thank you.